I remember when PE took over my dentist’s practice. Before the takeover I went in every six to twelve months, they did their cleaning and on average maybe every two years they found a little something to fix. After the takeover there was a problem with every visit together with a four digit treatment offered. My current dentist is a family practice and now we are back to the old rhythm.
A new dental scam is to pull healthy teeth to sell you expensive fake ones
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Re: A new dental scam is to pull healthy teeth to sell you expensive fake ones
#112This might sound stupid but I refuse to go to dentists that have "too nice" of an office. Over the years I have lived in several places and had a variety of dentists and one common theme that sticks with me, the nicer and higher tech the office is, the more procedures they are going to recommend you. They need to pay for the equipment and office somehow. I've had one dentist say I need 3 cavities filled. That I neede…
I think the sweet spot is a somewhat younger dentist that has their own office with a few exam rooms, and avoid the businesses that are multiple dentists. I say somewhat younger because solo dentists seem to mostly buy their equipment once, presumably mortgaging it over decades, and then retire when it's mostly used up. So a younger one is going to have the technical advantages that the older ones don't. I much prefe…
Yeah, my best dentist experiences have all been with a practice where it's just the owner (or a family operation). Practices where it's a bunch of dentists in some corporate thing never have been as good.
Re: A new dental scam is to pull healthy teeth to sell you expensive fake ones
#113It's a bit off topic but I often wonder why dentistry is not a specialization of medicine (like e.g. dermatology) but is its own separate thing, with separate insurance, etc. Dental health is part of being healthy. A lot of dental work is surgery. To me, it should be part of regular medical care.
There is some history here, at least in the US. As I recall, when "modern medicine" was first forming, there was a push to make it part of what we would consider standard medical care, but another, more influential party decided (incorrectly) that teeth weren't living tissue and should be excluded. The divide took hold and we ended up with the system we have today, where teeth are independent of the rest of the medic…
You’re right, there’s a history.
The reason I remember (I don’t know which of us or both are right) is that modern doctors came out of the “medical”/healing specialty where as dentists came out of the barber/surgeon tradition.
So I believe doctors didn’t want to admit their inferiors (barbers who pull teeth) to the profession and so that’s why dentists were kept out.
Overtime they’ve both grown in parallel since they end up covering a lot of the same things. X-rays, infections, medications + dosages. but dentist still get different training than “real“ doctors.
It does seem like dentistry should probably be a specialty of a normal doctor program at this point, but it’s not for some kind of historical reason as you mentioned.
Re: A new dental scam is to pull healthy teeth to sell you expensive fake ones
#114My wife, who is a recent immigrant to the US, when she goes to get her teeth cleaned here is what happens: dental hygeniest does there thing, X-rays are taken that weren't asked for, dentist come in to review the photos, sure enough her mouth is falling apart and she has loads of cavities, then they want to discuss a treatment plan. When she gets home we discuss it and agree $8000 in Invisalign is a bit excessive. Th…
You are saying that multiple dentists found issues with your wife's teeth, she routinely refuses treatment, and this is somehow a scam?
She's going in for cleanings. If she's not experiencing problems, what does that tell you about the prognoses she's receiving?
Re: A new dental scam is to pull healthy teeth to sell you expensive fake ones
#115This might sound stupid but I refuse to go to dentists that have "too nice" of an office. Over the years I have lived in several places and had a variety of dentists and one common theme that sticks with me, the nicer and higher tech the office is, the more procedures they are going to recommend you. They need to pay for the equipment and office somehow. I've had one dentist say I need 3 cavities filled. That I neede…
It doesn't cost that much to have a nice office. A better way of judging is how much stuff your dentist places on 'watch' rather than recommending expensive treatments. As we get older our teeth become less perfect and there will always be some work that needs to be done. Most of it isn't urgent, has no effect on your health and can take years to deteriorate to a state where it does. If your dentist isn't telling you…
>A better way of judging is how much stuff your dentist places on 'watch' rather than recommending expensive treatments.
This, I've had the same tooth on 'watch' for a few years. One of the times they showed me the difference, the one on watch has a crack in the enamel but no rot underneath it, vs one with a crack in the enamel with visible staining going down into the tooth. That's one nice thing with a newer dentist, they can actually show you this visual on a giant monitor vs you just having to take their word for it. I'm sure a less conservative dentist would fill any tooth that had any sort of cracked enamel and spend the profits on buying a new boat.
Re: A new dental scam is to pull healthy teeth to sell you expensive fake ones
#116The first time I visited USA about 15 years ago, the cold weather must have been too much for me, I developed a sharp pain in my right lower jaw. Visited a dentist who took a full mouth X ray, diagnosed a "horizontally impacted" tooth that was causing it. She used a form of chain of thought reasoning to deduce that I should get FIVE of my teeth pulled from all corners of my jaws, and referred me to a dental surgeon w…
I have a great local family dentist, originally from Sryia.
He strongly believes keeping the original tooth at all costs.
I had my tooth crack off at the gumline (minus a small corner), long story, but I thought for sure it was a goner. He spent two days on a root canal and crown and it's still perfect 3 years later.
Re: A new dental scam is to pull healthy teeth to sell you expensive fake ones
#117I fail to see how this “your dentist is taking advantage of you” narrative is any different than the anti vaccine FUD. To reap the benefits of our society of specialists, we have to trust the specialists in our lives…
I'd say we have to rely on the specialists in our lives, because we can't all do the same things they do, but not that we should trust them without any other reason. There are clearly people pulling scams—or simply making honest mistakes—so it would be irrational to blindly trust all specialists simply because they are specialists. That's especially true when they have a financial interest in taking a certain position. In a marketplace with many specialists who are able to offer the same service, it makes most sense to be skeptical, and I doubt you'd find many knowledgeable folks who don't advocate getting a second opinion when making a significant financial or health-related decision.
Re: A new dental scam is to pull healthy teeth to sell you expensive fake ones
#118The dental 'Rewrite it in Rust' gambit?
Most certainly not. Software rewrites usually are well-intentioned and might have benefits. Dental replacements like these are certainly not well-intentioned and only the dentist benefits from them.
Unnecessary rewrites are a way for engineers to benefit themselves (more fun than maintaining existing stable technology, updating resume with new technology) and not the company.
It's not that all rewrites are this way, or that all dentists are corrupt. But both patterns exist.
Re: A new dental scam is to pull healthy teeth to sell you expensive fake ones
#119This might sound stupid but I refuse to go to dentists that have "too nice" of an office. Over the years I have lived in several places and had a variety of dentists and one common theme that sticks with me, the nicer and higher tech the office is, the more procedures they are going to recommend you. They need to pay for the equipment and office somehow. I've had one dentist say I need 3 cavities filled. That I neede…
Similar experience, not with the office but with the dentist himself - he came across as way too artificially nice, more like a salesman than a dentist, then recommended 4 treatments, 2 of which were unnecessary according to the second opinion I got.
Re: A new dental scam is to pull healthy teeth to sell you expensive fake ones
#120Earlier quoted context omitted.
This also applies to several other competitive industries with asymmetric information — auto repair, plumbing, and HVAC come to mind. Consumers have to place their trust in someone. It always pays to be an informed consumer. Sometimes, I guess you have to pick and choose your battles.
This is why the consequences of dishonesty in such asymmetric dynamics need to be not just major, but stunningly, shockingly severe; e.g., seizure of all assets, including homes and anything that would otherwise be protected to totally impoverish them and bar them from any professional position for life. These types of relationships are the bullseye for deterrence through sever punishment; they are deliberative offen…
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