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A new dental scam is to pull healthy teeth to sell you expensive fake ones

arstechnica.com

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Re: A new dental scam is to pull healthy teeth to sell you expensive fake ones

#101

Post by causal »

yardie wrote: post #33

My wife, who is a recent immigrant to the US, when she goes to get her teeth cleaned here is what happens: dental hygeniest does there thing, X-rays are taken that weren't asked for, dentist come in to review the photos, sure enough her mouth is falling apart and she has loads of cavities, then they want to discuss a treatment plan. When she gets home we discuss it and agree $8000 in Invisalign is a bit excessive. Th…

Do dentists make a lot from Invisalign? Wife and I both were being pushed Invisalign at a new dentist office and I'm pretty sure neither of us need it.

Re: A new dental scam is to pull healthy teeth to sell you expensive fake ones

#103

Post by dopylitty »

belter wrote: post #59
dopylitty wrote: post #30

I looked into this "ClearChoice" company and unsurprisingly it's private equity owned through a chain of sketchy intermediaries. If you're having any sort of medical or other work done make sure the company is not PE owned or affiliated. The best way to check that I've found is to look for press releases. In this case there's a press release from 2020[0] about "The Aspen Group" acquiring ClearChoice. The Aspen Group…

Is there a case where a private equity organization has been proven not to be shady? Would love some examples. "Warren Buffett: Private Equity Firms Are Typically Very Dishonest" - https://youtu.be/r3_41Whvr1I

There might be one case somewhere that could be found where a firm that technically counts as PE isn't shady but in general the very idea of private equity is shady so it follows that all the PE firms would be shady also.

The point of PE isn't to run sustainable businesses that provide quality products and services for customers while treating their employees well. The point is to rapidly suck all the value out of businesses by loading them up with debt, breaking laws, mistreating customers, and exploiting employees. What happens to the carcass of the business or to the customers and employees whose lives have been destroyed doesn't matter to them.

Re: A new dental scam is to pull healthy teeth to sell you expensive fake ones

#104

Post by rqtwteye »

codingwagie wrote: post #98
hansonkd wrote: post #31

This might sound stupid but I refuse to go to dentists that have "too nice" of an office. Over the years I have lived in several places and had a variety of dentists and one common theme that sticks with me, the nicer and higher tech the office is, the more procedures they are going to recommend you. They need to pay for the equipment and office somehow. I've had one dentist say I need 3 cavities filled. That I neede…

Huge amount of fraud in the dental space, even in places like NYC.

I think that’s all over the medical sector. Knee operations for which there is no proof of benefit, screenings where the result makes no difference, expensive back surgeries instead of physical therapy and exercise, expensive drugs instead of nutrition changes.

There is just too much money to be made.

Re: A new dental scam is to pull healthy teeth to sell you expensive fake ones

#105

Post by albert_e »

The first time I visited USA about 15 years ago, the cold weather must have been too much for me, I developed a sharp pain in my right lower jaw.

Visited a dentist who took a full mouth X ray, diagnosed a "horizontally impacted" tooth that was causing it.

She used a form of chain of thought reasoning to deduce that I should get FIVE of my teeth pulled from all corners of my jaws, and referred me to a dental surgeon who just so happens to be her husband.

Instead, I used clove oil as a topical remedy and managed the pain for the rest of my stay.

Back in my home country I did get the horizontal tooth extracted and a root canal treatment on the adjacent one. Paid only a fraction of my month's salary which was also reimbursed by my employer insurance.

I am happily living with rest of the three teeth intact. (I did have other dental issues since but not with these ones she wanted to pull.)

The dentists I consulted back in my home country (India) have been fairly conservative before recommending invasive procedures. More than once they wanted to double-check and confirm they understood the root cause before doing any procedure on a particular tooth, lest they leave the problem unsolved while creating needless expense and complications.

Re: A new dental scam is to pull healthy teeth to sell you expensive fake ones

#106

Post by SoftTalker »

anonu wrote: post #19
wing-_-nuts wrote: post #2

I went to a new dentist when I was 18 because my other dentist was unavailable. He declares that I have two cavities and fills one, but doesn't use enough anesthetic. Given my bad exp with him I went back to my other dentist who's flabbergasted that there was supposedly a cavity on the other tooth. No sign of any decay. These kind of experiences are why I try to vet a new dentist very hard before trusting them, even…

I am pretty sure Ive had cavities taken care of that were not cavities. Ultimately its a small procedure and nets the dentist a few $100 bucks - and the patient can't be bothered to get a 2nd opinion. Maybe this is where AI helps with analysis of x-rays. Is there really an urgent issue? Or can it wait?

Some dentists want to fill "crevices" that may become a problem later, others wait until there is a problem. I've been fortunate to mostly have dentists that were happy to just do the semi-annual cleaning and annual xrays and nothing more than that unless I had a complaint or they spotted obvious decay.

Re: A new dental scam is to pull healthy teeth to sell you expensive fake ones

#107

Post by Balgair »

hansonkd wrote: post #31

This might sound stupid but I refuse to go to dentists that have "too nice" of an office. Over the years I have lived in several places and had a variety of dentists and one common theme that sticks with me, the nicer and higher tech the office is, the more procedures they are going to recommend you. They need to pay for the equipment and office somehow. I've had one dentist say I need 3 cavities filled. That I neede…

One rule I have found useful with dentists:

If you can see another dentist from the parking lot of the dentist you are going into, find a third.

Re: A new dental scam is to pull healthy teeth to sell you expensive fake ones

#108

Post by Suppafly »

hansonkd wrote: post #31

This might sound stupid but I refuse to go to dentists that have "too nice" of an office. Over the years I have lived in several places and had a variety of dentists and one common theme that sticks with me, the nicer and higher tech the office is, the more procedures they are going to recommend you. They need to pay for the equipment and office somehow. I've had one dentist say I need 3 cavities filled. That I neede…

I think the sweet spot is a somewhat younger dentist that has their own office with a few exam rooms, and avoid the businesses that are multiple dentists. I say somewhat younger because solo dentists seem to mostly buy their equipment once, presumably mortgaging it over decades, and then retire when it's mostly used up. So a younger one is going to have the technical advantages that the older ones don't. I much prefer the newer ones that have digital xray systems and can show you the images on a giant monitor vs the ones that are developing xrays and looking at tiny images. It's amazing how much nicer the newer drills and suction and stuff are too, it's a much nicer experience when everything is battery operated and they aren't dragging hoses and wires across you.

Re: A new dental scam is to pull healthy teeth to sell you expensive fake ones

#109

Post by SoftTalker »

ilc wrote: post #81
cj wrote: post #18

This reminds me of when I went to a dentist in SF who told me I needed to have my wisdom teeth out. I did the initial exam, and then hesitated when it came to booking the procedure. The dentist noticed my hesitation, and said something along the lines of "And after the surgery, don't forget we'll also prescribe really great pain medication!" 10 years later my new dentist says the wisdom teeth are fine and to leave th…

Odd, my dentist's hygenist complains that people who have their wisdom teeth suck at taking care of them in general. Mine got pulled for good reason. They were severely impacted, and pushing other teeth out of alignment. (I can still feel that I have out of alignment teeth in the far back of my mouth.) Not everyone should "keep their wisdom teeth." Sometimes... they gotta go.

Mine were not impacted but they are the hardest teeth to keep clean as they are so far back in the jaw. I've since had two of them pulled for decay, the other two are still healthy.

Re: A new dental scam is to pull healthy teeth to sell you expensive fake ones

#110

Post by causal »

ThinkingGuy wrote: post #89
azinman2 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The biggest problem is the cost of education. People have loans to repay, and then don’t take time to apprentice like they used to. In dentistry this leads to a lot of unnecessary work. In medicine this leads to very short appointments, and fewer doctors.

One explanation I've read is that fluoridation of drinking water plus improved dental hygiene in general has decreased the average number of cavities in the population, driving dentists to pursue other income sources, such as cosmetic procedures (my last dentists was always trying to push Invisilign on me).

New dentist keeps trying to push Invisalign on my family, thinking about switching for that reason alone. Haven't needed braces my whole life and suddenly I'm getting a sales pitch about all the terrible things Invisalign could prevent.
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