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ChatGPT Search

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Re: ChatGPT Search

#501

Post by ryandrake »

jahewson wrote: post #368
wvenable wrote: post #286

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Will this fundamentally change how people find and access information? How do you create an experience so compelling that it replaces the current paradigm? I think it's already compelling enough to replace the current paradigm. Search is pretty much dead to me. I have to end every search with "reddit" to get remotely useful results. The concern I have with LLMs replacing search is that once it starts being monetize…

Reddit is astroturfed pretty hard too nowadays. It just takes more work to spot it.

Yea, the whole "Scope your search to reddit" idea always comes up, but it just seems like a really terrible idea. How does one know for sure that the results from Reddit are any more accurate or authoritative than random SEO spam? There's very little curation or moderation there--anyone could post anything there. I could go there and comment on a subject that I have zero expertise in, make it sound confidently correct, and your reddit-scoped search might find it. Why would you trust it?

Re: ChatGPT Search

#503

Post by gr__or »

freedomben wrote: post #436
freediver wrote: post #241

Been thinking about this a lot [1]. Will this fundamentally change how people find and access information? How do you create an experience so compelling that it replaces the current paradigm? The future promised in Star Trek and even Apple's Knowledge Navigator [2] from 1987 still feels distant. In those visions, users simply asked questions and received reliable answers - nobody had to fact-check the answers ever. C…

I genuinely think Kagi has led the way on this one. Simplicity is beautiful and effective, and Kagi has (IMHO) absolutely nailed it with their AI approach. It's one of those things that in hindsight seems obvious, which is a pretty good measure of how good an idea is IMHO. Google could have done it and kind of tried, although they're AI sucks too much. I'm very surprised that OpenAI hasn't done this sooner as well. T…

I don’t understand how it’s different to Perplexity, looks pretty much the same. Can you enlighten me?

Re: ChatGPT Search

#504

Post by blackeyeblitzar »

freediver wrote: post #241

Been thinking about this a lot [1]. Will this fundamentally change how people find and access information? How do you create an experience so compelling that it replaces the current paradigm? The future promised in Star Trek and even Apple's Knowledge Navigator [2] from 1987 still feels distant. In those visions, users simply asked questions and received reliable answers - nobody had to fact-check the answers ever. C…

Yes the incentives will need to change. I think it’s also going to be a bigger question than just software. What do we do in general about those that control capital or distribution channels and end up rent seeking? How do others thrive in that environment?

In the short term, I wonder what happens to a lot of the other startups in the AI search space - companies like Perplexity or Glean, for example.

Re: ChatGPT Search

#505

Post by IshKebab »

greenavocado wrote: post #483
umvi wrote: post #451

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At some point it seems like Google switch to ML-based search instead of index based search. You can search for very specific combinations of lyrics and scenes: "eyes on me pineapple bucket of water house of cards chess time loop" and you won't surface a link to the music video featuring all of those things ( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AlzgDVLtU6g ), you'll just get really generic results of the average of your q…

Has google completely stopped working for anyone else? I can still search things, i get results but, they're an ordered list of popular places the engine is directing me to. Some kind of filtering is occurring on nearly every search i make that's making the results feel entirely useless. Image search stopped working sometime ago and now it just runs an AI filter on whatever image you search for, tells you there's a m…

Despite all the comments it still works pretty well for me. I feel like they've improved it a bit in the last year or so so you don't get way too much Quora and GitHub/Stackoverflow clones.

The level of sponsored results for some queries is way OTT, and obviously any kind of search like "best laptop 2024" is never going to give you good results (probably because they don't exist), but other than that I'm still pretty happy with Google Search.

Re: ChatGPT Search

#506

Post by nikcub »

freediver wrote: post #241

Been thinking about this a lot [1]. Will this fundamentally change how people find and access information? How do you create an experience so compelling that it replaces the current paradigm? The future promised in Star Trek and even Apple's Knowledge Navigator [2] from 1987 still feels distant. In those visions, users simply asked questions and received reliable answers - nobody had to fact-check the answers ever. C…

I now only use Google for local search.

Regarding incentives - with Perplexity, ChatGPT search et al. skinning web content - where does it leave the incentive to publish good, original web content?

The only incentivised publishing today is in social media silos, where it is primarily engagement bait. It's the new SEO.

Re: ChatGPT Search

#507

Post by coffeemug »

whizzter wrote: post #300

This is probably Google's Altavista moment, by making their results crappier by the year in search of Ad dollars everyone has felt that there is a potential for search to be better and once that becomes available they'll be in a continious game of catch-up. Yes, Google has their own AI divisions, tons of money and SEO is to blame for part of their crappiness. But they've also _explicitly_ focused on ad-dollars over a…

Google is entirely to blame. It would be trivial for them to train a model to rank sites on a scale of SEO garbage to nobel laureate essay, then filter out the bottom 50%.

Re: ChatGPT Search

#508

Post by nosbo »

rawgabbit wrote: post #415
whizzter wrote: post #300

This is probably Google's Altavista moment, by making their results crappier by the year in search of Ad dollars everyone has felt that there is a potential for search to be better and once that becomes available they'll be in a continious game of catch-up. Yes, Google has their own AI divisions, tons of money and SEO is to blame for part of their crappiness. But they've also _explicitly_ focused on ad-dollars over a…

For me the key difference between ChatGPT Search and Google is the feedback mechanism. With ChatGPT, I can give a thumbs up or thumbs down; this means that OpenAI will optimize for users thumbs up. With Google, the feedback is if I click on an Ad; this means that Google optimizes for clickbait.

Is it optimising for all users? And assuming people thumbs up the correct info. I wonder what accuracy percentage we are looking at there. ChatGPTs responses are so confident when wrong I fear people will just give it a thumbs up when its wrong. (This is if how I understand the feature you mention is working)

Re: ChatGPT Search

#509

Post by radicality »

gr__or wrote: post #503
freedomben wrote: post #436

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I genuinely think Kagi has led the way on this one. Simplicity is beautiful and effective, and Kagi has (IMHO) absolutely nailed it with their AI approach. It's one of those things that in hindsight seems obvious, which is a pretty good measure of how good an idea is IMHO. Google could have done it and kind of tried, although they're AI sucks too much. I'm very surprised that OpenAI hasn't done this sooner as well. T…

I don’t understand how it’s different to Perplexity, looks pretty much the same. Can you enlighten me?

Not op, but Kagi user. Also have perplexity but usually use kagi.

I would say: 1) The UI. You’re still performing normal searches in Kagi. But if you hit q, or end your query with a question mark, you get an llm synthesized answer at the top, but can still browse and click through the normal search results.

2) Kagi has personalization, ie you uprank/downrank/block domains, so the synthesized llm answer should usually be better because it has your personalized search as input.

Re: ChatGPT Search

#510

Post by SOLAR_FIELDS »

alfalfasprout wrote: post #458
freedomben wrote: post #436

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I genuinely think Kagi has led the way on this one. Simplicity is beautiful and effective, and Kagi has (IMHO) absolutely nailed it with their AI approach. It's one of those things that in hindsight seems obvious, which is a pretty good measure of how good an idea is IMHO. Google could have done it and kind of tried, although they're AI sucks too much. I'm very surprised that OpenAI hasn't done this sooner as well. T…

Yep, I was incredibly skeptical about Kagi but I tried it and never looked back. Now my wife, friends, and several coworkers are customers. The chatgpt approach to search just feels forced and not as intuitive.

Once Kagi implements location aware search that is actually useful I’ll be interested in Kagi. That’s what made me leave the engine besides loving it otherwise.
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