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Wait Until 8th

waituntil8th.org

111–120 of 351 posts

Re: Wait Until 8th

#111

IMHO, this feels like another wave of nannyism that follows after a new technology matures. Being a 90s kid, discovering porn, violence, warez were all normal part of growing up that I don't think has had any negative impact nor do the puritan panic about pornography. Matter of fact the internet started speedrunning censorship and monopolization post 9/11 without much of a fight and I think this triggered the default…

The 2000s-2010s was incredibly rewarding for curious kids, not just because of what was out there, but because of the effort required to get such payoffs was high.

The reward of watching porn on the family computer was sneaking down the stairs at 3am, hoping no one heard the dialup tone, finding the right website, and waiting for the pixels to load.

Later, that moved into bedroom and with faster internet, and the result was slightly less pixelated boobs. And it was just out there, to be watched.

The internet today is not there to be observed. It's to be consumed, and then to stalk you even after you've left. It's not even at your fingertips anymore; it's in your bed, at full resolution, recommending you products that you actively ignore but passively absorb.

At that young impressionable age, the passive inputs are definitely the ones to monitor

Re: Wait Until 8th

#112

I'm still surprised the "dumb phone for kids" and "dumb watch with basic comms" markets are so underdeveloped (from my perspective). I would love my kids to have (a) gps tracking, (b) ability to send texts/calls to like 5 predefined numbers, (c) tell the time, and nothing else. But watches all seem to have games or weird gamified fitness trackers (Google's new fitbit for kids). Or they are super kid-ish, like bright…

They already make this. Gizmo on Verizon. SyncUp on T-Mobile. Garmin bounce if you’re ok with them only being able to send voice memos and not call.

Re: Wait Until 8th

#113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is clearly aimed at Americans only.

I think I’m missing your point. Would you rather I had not posted the age for people outside the US?

No, I'm saying the website is aimed squarely at those in the U.S.

Re: Wait Until 8th

#114
post #86
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Kids entire social lives run on their phones. Covid accelerated this and pushed down the age for where this was true. Denying your kid a smart phone is basically denying them a social life nowadays. It simply doesn't work unless everyone does it.

> Kids entire social lives run on their phones. > Denying your kid a smart phone is basically denying them a social life nowadays. Wow, what country is that true? Thankfully, not in the country I reside. None of the children I know have social lives that revolve around the phone. Wherever you live, if the phone is already the central aspect of a child's social life, that is a great tragedy.

Pretty much secondary school in the UK (12+). I'm guessing middle schools / high schools in the US are the same? Yes, literally every kid in secondary school has a cell phone. Kids have whatsapp groups and communicate all the time with their friend circles.

According to an Ofcom survey in 2023, 9 in 10 kids aged 11 have a smartphone in the UK.

1: https://commonslibrary.parliament.uk/research-briefings/cdp-...

Re: Wait Until 8th

#115
post #30

I’d like to see something for this for travel sports.

Grew up with a few guys who made pro teams and travel didnt help any of them or any of the other schlubs like me. Many of the best guys didnt even do travel for money or other reasons. We would have been better off playing at the park on the weekends.

Re: Wait Until 8th

#116
This is a bandaid on a bullet hole. The root issue is that tech leaders (yes, these decision-makers are real, individual people, let's stop diluting accountability!) have forced themselves onto us and our kids with tracking, data mining, personalised advertising, distortion of facts, dark patterns, addiction-forming products, plausible but false AI content, brand-compliance, and all sorts of other user exploitation.

The social media/internet landscape as it exists today will probably be the smoking of this generation – everyone is doing it and many will die prematurely (due to stress, depression, lack of motivation and purpose, addiction), or waste so many years of their life consuming product that it will be a pretty good equivalent for dying early. And while banning the equivalent of cigarettes for kids a damn good idea, we definitely need to quit scrolling ourselves into a premature grave, too.

Why are we consuming it? Participating in the popular internet today shouldn't be "wait until 8th", but "wait a moment, you don't want this in your life, and the people around you don't want to deal with you involving them into it second-hand either".

Re: Wait Until 8th

#117
> Let’s protect the elementary and middle school years from the distractions and the dangers of a smartphone.

> … because of unrealistic social pressure and expectations to have one.

Sorry, but I do not agree with the equivalence of a device and one of its possible usages.

My kids got their first smartphone at the ages of 5-6. (dramatic pause)

When I was younger me and my siblings got a camera, a Game Boy, a watch, a walkman, a calculator, a stopwatch and small handheld battery-driven games. Later a tamagotchi and whatever was trending. Also we were taught to use the phone-booth in case of an "emergency". While you do not have to agree that all of us needed all of this, nobody would've said to "wait until the age of 13" with all of this.

The phone I gave my kids were retired Android smartphones with Lineage OS installed. Almost all Google Apps removed or disarmed. I preinstalled Apps like: a calculator, camera, a secure messenger (Threema), clock, navigation (OSMAnd), a few educational games, a paint/drawing app, a calendar and added the most important contacts (Parents, siblings, grandparents) to the address book. We added more apps over time when we felt they might benefit from them.

We agreed upon usage duration and modalities. We mostly moved their TV-time towards their phones. We explained how to ask before taking a photo of a person.

What happened? My Kids started to get interested in how to read/write, used the navigation software during road-trips to find the next possible stop to have a break or try to find POIs along the road and wait them to pass by. They played with the calculator, started to learn English (non-native if that wasn't obvious, yet), started to "program" robots, send me "good nights" when I was late at work. Call me if they spontaneously decided to stay with a friend after school. Take photos during their holidays, listen to audiobooks during road-trips. Play with the torchlight in the tent.

The older one is now 12. She got access to our family calender and contact list, so she can plan her appointments with friends around ours, manage her ToDo-lists, make stop-motion videos, research all sorts of stuff on wikipedia, gain a very good understanding of how those devices work. Learn to take care of expensive gears and how it matters to have control over their own data and that backups are important. She learns how to manage her data plan by moving audiobooks for offline-usage. Also she helps her grandparents with all sorts of technical problems they have with their phones.

Yes, it's more work to teach a kid how to work with all this stuff than just throw an iPhone at them when they turn 13 and say "whoa, finally old enough to figure this all out." What could go wrong. Sorry, that I'm a bit salty on this topic (and I sometimes might not find the right words due to the language barrier), but just saying that a smartphone is bad because parents do not care for what their kids are doing with the device just feels plain wrong to me.

Re: Wait Until 8th

#119
post #92
post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

More like snobism: reading classic books for the sake of being able to brag about them. As if that made someone a better person. If the author at least did something creative... but nooo reading Brothers Karamazov as a kid is better than playing WoW. I still take the kid who created something, or at least spent time with other kids. And apparently the author didnt.

I would say yes, reading Brothers Karamazov is probably a better use for a developing mind's time than playing WoW. Hell, that's a better use for an adult's time than playing WoW. But adults get to do whatever they want with their free time, and it would be hypocritical of me to judge.

The kid who plays wow at least plays in a group. And Dostoyevsky.. "Crime and punishment" is one of the worst books I ever read. You van literally skip 90% of it. Could be a 2 page short story.

But feel free to downvote, apparently reading the classics makes one a classy person, not a dumb snob who thinks they are better than everyone...

Re: Wait Until 8th

#120
post #55
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Everyone has a different threshold for what they want from a dumb phone, some wants Google Maps, some think Youtube is ok, Google Chrome etc. which makes it hard to have a one true dumb phone. If you give access to the play store it's no longer a dumb phone The best way to have a dumb phone tailored to your needs is to take a cheap smartphone and make it dumb, either by using a different launcher, or a customized OS…

It’s true. My daughter didn’t have a phone until 9th grade, which she just started. She had talked about getting a dumb phone because she wasn’t very into the smartphone thing, which I was supportive of. However she now takes public transit to high school, and really wanted the Transit app so she could easily navigate in the city. So, an iPhone is where we landed. And I have to say, it is astounding how quickly that…

Out of curiosity, what are her phone habits like? And, as others have mentioned, you can turn on parental controls to limit what apps she can have on it. Have you done this already?
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