Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

We're forking Flutter

flutterfoundation.dev

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

561–570 of 748 posts

Re: We're forking Flutter

#561

Post by zaphirplane »

deergomoo wrote: post #215
divan wrote: post #120

> We describe Flock as "Flutter+". In other words, we do not want, or intend, to fork the Flutter community. Flock will remain constantly up to date with Flutter. That was the first fear when I saw the title - splitting community and having two incompatible versions. Good to see it addressed in the post. The second was just a fear of how it would complicate the development process, but it seems to be a drop-in replac…

> Most people don't realize how many apps written in Flutter they use daily, simply because it's impossible to tell You can't be serious. Maybe on Android, but on other platforms—especially iOS—they stick out like a sore thumb. A number of them just look like Material Design Android apps awkwardly transplanted over, but I know that's down to the developer so I won't hold that against Flutter. But scrolling through th…

Over time I have become convinced that the, fit in argument is not something that actual users care for.

The sometime subjective aesthetic reasoning doesn’t mean the application can’t succeed. office ribbon is an example

Re: We're forking Flutter

#562

Post by zigzag312 »

DeathArrow wrote: post #502

The thing I dislike about Dart and some other language like Swift or Ruby is that they only have one application. With Dart you write Flutter aps. With Swift you write iOS apps. With Ruby you write Rails apps. Java, C#, Rust, C, C++, Go, Python are usable for more than one thing. I am not saying Dart and Flutter aren't nice, but for sure I would love to see Dart extending to more than just Flutter and making Dart usa…

C# port of Flutter would be a dream.

Re: We're forking Flutter

#563

Post by auggierose »

eseidel wrote: post #238
gman83 wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No Eric founded Flutter at Google. However, Google had previously acquired another company called Flutter, and they had that domain lying around, and decided to use it. That's what I understood, at least.

Correct.

Are you by any chance also a famous poker player? ;-)

Re: We're forking Flutter

#564

Post by mirzap »

divan wrote: post #233
deergomoo wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Most people don't realize how many apps written in Flutter they use daily, simply because it's impossible to tell You can't be serious. Maybe on Android, but on other platforms—especially iOS—they stick out like a sore thumb. A number of them just look like Material Design Android apps awkwardly transplanted over, but I know that's down to the developer so I won't hold that against Flutter. But scrolling through th…

Sure, but not every cross-platform app developer wants their app to look "native to iOS". Especially if you want your app to look the same on all platforms and/or have some creative design.

Developers who think that way have no clue what their users want. Most iOS users want a native experience, not something else. When I see an app that doesn't have that, I quickly lose interest. Having the app look the same on all platforms is a dumb idea to start with.

Re: We're forking Flutter

#565

Post by pjmlp »

lolinder wrote: post #403
FredPret wrote: post #394

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But those are modules added on by developers other than the 50 core devs.

The standard library alone has a huge scope which includes a (mediocre) GUI toolkit.

If only some homegrown GUI toolkits were half as good as Tcl/Tk.

Re: We're forking Flutter

#566

Post by tjpnz »

satvikpendem wrote: post #553
Capricorn2481 wrote: post #471

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Don't elaborate or anything.

I think they're referring to the extra frame of latency when scrolling on Android. But then again, I've literally never heard anyone complain about that, I honestly don't think anyone notices, I believe the GitHub issue had to use a slow motion camera to even capture the issue.

You'll notice it on higher refresh rates.

Re: We're forking Flutter

#567

Post by graemep »

zaphirplane wrote: post #561
deergomoo wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Most people don't realize how many apps written in Flutter they use daily, simply because it's impossible to tell You can't be serious. Maybe on Android, but on other platforms—especially iOS—they stick out like a sore thumb. A number of them just look like Material Design Android apps awkwardly transplanted over, but I know that's down to the developer so I won't hold that against Flutter. But scrolling through th…

Over time I have become convinced that the, fit in argument is not something that actual users care for. The sometime subjective aesthetic reasoning doesn’t mean the application can’t succeed. office ribbon is an example

I think you are correct, but I think your example is a bad one. Most people do not have a realistic (their employer will use it at work, it even occurs to them that they could use something else) alternative to MS Office so will use it whatever MS does.

Re: We're forking Flutter

#568

Post by ForHackernews »

divan wrote: post #547
madeofpalk wrote: post #384

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What are some examples of good 'impossible to tell' UIs built with flutter on desktop or web?

My comment was related to mobile apps. Web apps built on Flutter definitely can be distinguished. The thing is, with web apps, people have developed feelings for the "nativeness" - because browsers make a lot of UI choices for them. A typical example is a selection of the text. Because web apps are built using XML-based typesetting language from 80-s, everything is selectable by default. No matter how many layers of…

> But when you actually think about it, it's an insanely stupid UI choice that neither of proper UI frameworks would even consider.

You say "insanely stupid", I say wonderful.

Everything you apparently hate about the web is what makes it good for users. Content is primary, and my user agent can resize it, restyle it, copy it, extract it, link it, read it to a blind person...

If you want to make a binary blob app, just make that. Stop trying to break the web.

Re: We're forking Flutter

#569

Post by chrismorgan »

satvikpendem wrote: post #556
chrismorgan wrote: post #462

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you care about the web at all as a target, you must not use Flutter. It’s awful. They used to have a DOM renderer which you could use and everything would be fine, but apparently no one used it because it wasn’t perfect, and they’ve recently deprecated it and will remove it sooner or later—they’re doubling down on the pure-canvas direction where it’s completely impossible to produce a good result. And I do mean im…

Flutter Web is for web apps, not web sites, so much of those concerns don't necessarily apply. And it's not "impossible" simply because Chrome itself runs on Skia which until recently Flutter did too, so clearly they were able to implement scrolling at least one time correctly.

> Flutter Web is for web apps, not web sites

When you want to draw this distinction: most web apps will still suffer heavily for many users if they use Flutter. To begin with, few web apps don’t use text, scrolling, or form fields. Games are almost the only thing that may not suffer, or only barely suffer. But beyond that: well, that’s what they say its purpose is, but at least two of the three times I’ve encountered Flutter in the wild on the web, it was inappropriate, and frustrating; regular DOM should certainly have been used. (The third, I’ve forgotten what it was. It was probably similarly inappropriate.)

Skia is not the bottleneck. The web platform is. Scrolling is limited on two counts: ① what browsers expose in events is insufficient to match the native implementation (which varies by platform) in scrolling amounts, overscroll behaviour, and related things; and ② the browser is a compositor, and your code will never get access to that layer, because it’s way too deep in performance-, security- and implementation-detail–land, so you’ll always be stuck at least sometimes at least one frame behind “native”, and janky.

Re: We're forking Flutter

#570

Post by stuaxo »

ToucanLoucan wrote: post #288
deergomoo wrote: post #251

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can appreciate that as a developer, but as a user I don’t particularly care that some company wants to ship identical looking apps on every device under the sun. I would prefer the apps I use to work and behave in a consistent way, using the same platform idioms I am used to. The software available and how it works was a large part of the reason I chose the platform I did. Of course, I recognise that, a. most peopl…

> I would prefer the apps I use to work and behave in a consistent way, using the same platform idioms I am used to. The software available and how it works was a large part of the reason I chose the platform I did. There are DOZENS of us!!! I try my absolute best to find apps that use the native Apple language, both design and code. I can't stand these framework apps. I will Pepsi challenge this with anyone who asks…

There was a time it looked like cross platform GUI toolkits would get us there, but things went in reverse.
Post reply on HN