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418 I’m a teapot

developer.mozilla.org

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Re: 418 I’m a teapot

#111

Post by declan_roberts »

cl0ckt0wer wrote: post #108
declan_roberts wrote: post #107

Every time I have encountered this error code in the wild I have been extremely frustrated. Somebody tries to be cheeky, and rather than just return the proper status code (like a 429 or 503) they return this, which breaks a lot of HTTP status code parsing. Not cheeky or funny. Boring actually. I know I'm boring but I have a job to do.

If your parser can't handle in-spec error codes, then that's a parser problem.

Regardless of the parser if you're using a 4XX status code when you should be using a 5XX status code then you're simply doing it wrong.

Re: 418 I’m a teapot

#112

Post by epc »

flir wrote: post #103
epc wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From personal experience search engines don’t honor 404 or 410. I switched much of my personal site to returning 410 over a decade ago and Googlebot still returns on a routine basis re-requesting a document that hasn’t been on the site since 2012.

Well... a thorough "meh" to Google. Thanks for the info though, one less thing for me to care about.

Out of paranoia I just checked and yeah, GoogleBot actual (and not the dozens of fakes) requested each 410'd URL at least once a month, some URLs get multiple requests per month. All have been marked 410 since 2014 or earlier.

Re: 418 I’m a teapot

#114

Post by pessimizer »

souldeux wrote: post #92
DanielHB wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem was people (including management) wanting to talk about where and how to put emojis once we added a few. The less I have to talk to management the better. All those small discussions were essentially pointless and they happened often enough that I was getting annoyed by them. Like, sometimes we would be showing "in development" stuff to clients and then they would interrupt and mention something like "nic…

> All those small discussions were essentially pointless Were they pointless, or were they positive feedback about a thing you personally disliked?

You're doing the thing he was trying to avoid. You want to have a discussion about this hypothetical emoji and make a bunch of statements about the psychology of the person who doesn't want to waste his life on it. Nothing like being accused of not liking "fun" when you don't want to do something useless at work.

Maybe not everybody likes goofy emojis, or Harry Potter references, or whatever easy nothing passes as wit for some people, and they think it makes everything less professional and introduces unnecessary maintenance. Those people have to make the choice to shut up about it, or mention it and have somebody tell them they're joyless.

edit: irt 418, it's historical and it has already imposed most of its maintenance burden. But using it when you're not a teapot is forcing the meme.

Re: 418 I’m a teapot

#115

Post by justin66 »

declan_roberts wrote: post #111
cl0ckt0wer wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If your parser can't handle in-spec error codes, then that's a parser problem.

Regardless of the parser if you're using a 4XX status code when you should be using a 5XX status code then you're simply doing it wrong.

Honestly this discussion makes the occasional "I'm a teapot" seem useful. Your log and error handling ought to be capable of handling occurrences of a programmer doing something goofy.

Re: 418 I’m a teapot

#116

Post by ToucanLoucan »

DanielHB wrote: post #58
0x00cl wrote: post #51

If you are bored you can read the discussion when _mnot_ tried removing 418 status code from different languages and implementations because it wasn't technically correct. https://github.com/nodejs/node/issues/14644 https://github.com/golang/go/issues/21326 And someone even ended up making a website http://save418.com/

This 418 stuff reminds me of a previous job where we had some arguments about putting emojis in our applications. I was against it and a coworker was for it. Like putting rocket ship emoji when an operation succeeds. My main argument was that if you put things like that in your applications then people start having opinions about it and they want to discuss it and add more to certain places or remove from other place…

> My main argument was that if you put things like that in your applications then people start having opinions about it

You can say this about literally any discussion outside the realm of bugfixes. And yes I do want to discuss the psychology behind this, because this is, IMO, a perfect example of the tendency for a certain kind of dude (usually dude, anyway) to ascribe "objective," "rational," or other such power-words to their own personal opinions and state them as though they are fact.

Emoji's are characters, my guy. That's it. And if the saying "A picture is worth a thousand words" holds any water... well, I think a thousand is pushing it, but I think an emoji can save you a bunch of words in certain contexts, and doesn't need nearly as much attention for localization.

The only pushback I see consistently on this is from old farts like myself who remember fondly the days pre-emoji and have feels about it. And having feels is completely fair, but trying to pass off your feels as facts doesn't fly.

Re: 418 I’m a teapot

#117

Post by impure »

I use 418 in place of 400. It doesn’t matter too much because too much information about the error is a security risk, I just give generic codes for everything. If you want to debug something look at the logs.

Re: 418 I’m a teapot

#118

Post by flir »

epc wrote: post #112
flir wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well... a thorough "meh" to Google. Thanks for the info though, one less thing for me to care about.

Out of paranoia I just checked and yeah, GoogleBot actual (and not the dozens of fakes) requested each 410'd URL at least once a month, some URLs get multiple requests per month. All have been marked 410 since 2014 or earlier.

Google has FoMO...

Re: 418 I’m a teapot

#119

Post by pmg101 »

DanielHB wrote: post #58
0x00cl wrote: post #51

If you are bored you can read the discussion when _mnot_ tried removing 418 status code from different languages and implementations because it wasn't technically correct. https://github.com/nodejs/node/issues/14644 https://github.com/golang/go/issues/21326 And someone even ended up making a website http://save418.com/

This 418 stuff reminds me of a previous job where we had some arguments about putting emojis in our applications. I was against it and a coworker was for it. Like putting rocket ship emoji when an operation succeeds. My main argument was that if you put things like that in your applications then people start having opinions about it and they want to discuss it and add more to certain places or remove from other place…

Surely both having and not-having emojis could be just as likely to trigger discussions about whether to have or not have emojis?

Sometimes I feel like the opposite of your position happens: just add the damn emojis already to put an end to the endless discussions about whether to add emojis

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