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The brain's waste clearing lymphatic system shown in people for first time

nih.gov

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Re: The brain's waste clearing lymphatic system shown in people for first time

#41

Post by flotzam »

PaulKeeble wrote: post #4

There have been a couple of papers [1] that can induce this process while awake using particular image patterns as confirmed in an MRI. I think the NIH confirmation is running behind in the science, independent research is quite a bit ahead of them. I came across the paper on this last year and implemented a very simple page with the parameters they used [2]. There is a number of disease models that show reduced or n…

Very cool! Five minutes of this felt strangely soothing in my head, after a few nights of not enough sleep.

Being able to set a max duration would be neat, in case it's unsafe to lose track of time and let the pattern run for too long?

Classic outdated comment BTW ;)

  setInterval(flickerImage, 250); // 8hz

Re: The brain's waste clearing lymphatic system shown in people for first time

#42

Post by amelius »

jdthedisciple wrote: post #11
PaulKeeble wrote: post #4

There have been a couple of papers [1] that can induce this process while awake using particular image patterns as confirmed in an MRI. I think the NIH confirmation is running behind in the science, independent research is quite a bit ahead of them. I came across the paper on this last year and implemented a very simple page with the parameters they used [2]. There is a number of disease models that show reduced or n…

It seems to have no effect on me. Am I an outlier?

Maybe try it again at the end of the workday?

Re: The brain's waste clearing lymphatic system shown in people for first time

#43

Post by haccount »

khafra wrote: post #10
PaulKeeble wrote: post #4

There have been a couple of papers [1] that can induce this process while awake using particular image patterns as confirmed in an MRI. I think the NIH confirmation is running behind in the science, independent research is quite a bit ahead of them. I came across the paper on this last year and implemented a very simple page with the parameters they used [2]. There is a number of disease models that show reduced or n…

This is some amazing work; and it also raises my belief that a Langford Basilisk is neurologically possible by about 25%

It's possible.

But only for the brains of people with severe or undertreated epilepsy of carefully selected varieties. You can trigger a potentially fatal seizure by showing them an appropriately stimulating image. Which likely was a known concept to the author of the story.

For the rest of us the negative feedback along the optical axis puts a stop to such shenanigans.

Re: The brain's waste clearing lymphatic system shown in people for first time

#44

Post by cassianoleal »

feoren wrote: post #19
PaulKeeble wrote: post #4

There have been a couple of papers [1] that can induce this process while awake using particular image patterns as confirmed in an MRI. I think the NIH confirmation is running behind in the science, independent research is quite a bit ahead of them. I came across the paper on this last year and implemented a very simple page with the parameters they used [2]. There is a number of disease models that show reduced or n…

Staring at the v0.3 produces an effect similar to something I'm able to do trigger manually on command. I've always had the feeling that I'm somehow triggering a "flow" in my brain, but I have no way to confirm what's actually going on. It's actually stronger when I trigger it manually, and it feels like it flows down my spine and eventually some weak signal reaches my extremities. (Maybe that means it's not CSF afte…

Yep, I can do that.

It's similar to the effect of being hit with big news (good or bad), and the "sinking" feeling that comes with it, becoming suddenly introspective and oddly calm under pressure.

At least to me, of course. I have no idea if others have that same reaction.

Re: The brain's waste clearing lymphatic system shown in people for first time

#45

Post by haccount »

rozab wrote: post #28
reverius42 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for introducing me to the concept! Just read the short story I assume you are referring to: https://www.infinityplus.co.uk/stories/blit.htm

I hadn't heard of this one before, it's also similar to the crucifix glitch in Peter Watts' Blindsight

Having read both Blindsight and Echopraxia I have to say the most impressive neurological takeaway from the books was the ability of my own brain to suspend critical thinking for long enough to enjoy the books.

In retrospect the core concept can be paraphrased as: Self-awareness and consciousness in pigs is the only thing that prevents them from flapping their trotters fast enough to fly(to the moon).

Re: The brain's waste clearing lymphatic system shown in people for first time

#46

Post by wyldfire »

LinuxBender wrote: post #23
giantg2 wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The places that specialize in full body scans will do it for cash. I think technically you need a script for any MRI, so you may still need to speak with a doctor ar their facility first. My understanding is it's more streamlined there and will be way cheaper than any hospital. If you talk to your primary or can get a telemedicine appointment online then they might be willing to write you the script and you can go to…

I think technically you need a script for any MRI I'm in the US. I am guessing a script is the same thing wherever you are as what is called a referral here. I will ask around. Thankyou for the idea. I will research what outpatient imaging facilities are around me. Would they use some kind of mirror system to watch this image? I can't imagine a PC could be near the MRI.

"script" is "prescription" (here in US and possibly elsewhere). Imaging techniques generally require them because medicine considers the potential harm of giving patients an inconclusive diagnosis or a conclusive diagnosis for which there's no treatment. Without a symptom to weigh against these risks, it makes some sense to consider them as not "over the counter".

But in practice I think you can show up at any imaging center and get some kind of "full body MRI" to screen for cancer or some other risk. They'll probably ask about family history and other predispositions but even if you didn't have those they'd still take your money.

Re: The brain's waste clearing lymphatic system shown in people for first time

#47

Post by hobs »

evanjrowley wrote: post #37
Karellen wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Looks like it, according to Wikipedia: https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Langford%27s_basilisk Just read the story, thought it was very reminiscent of one of the plot points in Neal Stephenson's Snow Crash (1992) - until I noticed the publication date of 1988, 4 years earlier!

You'll also find a similar concept throughout David Foster Wallace's Infinite Jest (1996).

Charles Stross who for some reason posted on usenet about it in the wikipedia article uses a form of this to great effect in several books in The Laundry Files

Re: The brain's waste clearing lymphatic system shown in people for first time

#48

Post by hobs »

sithadmin wrote: post #38
feoren wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Staring at the v0.3 produces an effect similar to something I'm able to do trigger manually on command. I've always had the feeling that I'm somehow triggering a "flow" in my brain, but I have no way to confirm what's actually going on. It's actually stronger when I trigger it manually, and it feels like it flows down my spine and eventually some weak signal reaches my extremities. (Maybe that means it's not CSF afte…

That just sounds like ASMR, which some folks can induce without external stimuli.

I think you are thinking of Frission https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frisson

Re: The brain's waste clearing lymphatic system shown in people for first time

#49

Post by bdd8f1df777b »

flotzam wrote: post #41
PaulKeeble wrote: post #4

There have been a couple of papers [1] that can induce this process while awake using particular image patterns as confirmed in an MRI. I think the NIH confirmation is running behind in the science, independent research is quite a bit ahead of them. I came across the paper on this last year and implemented a very simple page with the parameters they used [2]. There is a number of disease models that show reduced or n…

Very cool! Five minutes of this felt strangely soothing in my head, after a few nights of not enough sleep. Being able to set a max duration would be neat, in case it's unsafe to lose track of time and let the pattern run for too long? Classic outdated comment BTW ;) setInterval(flickerImage, 250); // 8hz

When I open the page, the image rotates for about ten seconds then vanishes. How do you watch it for five minutes? What did I do wrong?

Re: The brain's waste clearing lymphatic system shown in people for first time

#50

Post by lazypenguin »

sharpshadow wrote: post #36

“Other studies have suggested that the glymphatic system may be most active during sleep.” Not only that but also the right sleeping position is relevant here. I don’t recall the scientist but he studied primates and their natural sleeping position, exactly this position also opens up the channels for the cerebrospinal fluid to flush the accumulated brain waste.

Do you recall which position?
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