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Linus Torvalds comments on the Russian Linux maintainers being delisted

phoronix.com

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Re: Linus Torvalds comments on the Russian Linux maintainers being delisted

#171

Post by michaelmrose »

pphysch wrote: post #150
scoofy wrote: post #146

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Russia invaded it’s neighbor. These sanctions are one of the consequences. It sucks for the good-faith programmers in Russia but what would you have the rest of the world do? The Russian state must be sanctioned for its blatant disregard for international norms. Please don’t just respond with whataboutism. The whataboutism in these threads involves different people in different times. This is happening now.

You can't invoke "international norms" and then in the very next paragraph "but no talking about precedent, that would be whataboutism". Norms are established through precedents. There are considerable precedents in the 21st century that military invasions DO NOT lead to international sanctions. So this isn't a valid argument, and it's true that that decision was emotional and politically motivated.

This is arguing that we have not sanctioned murderous evil actions in the past therefore we must not do so now or ever after. It's a pretty bad argument.

Re: Linus Torvalds comments on the Russian Linux maintainers being delisted

#172

Post by michaelmrose »

pphysch wrote: post #158
scoofy wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you want perfect fairness for bullies, not victims, then you don’t actually care about victims at all. This whataboutism is a circular argument where any brazen invasion can be justified by some previous perceived slight. Because someone somewhere got away with something, now anything is permissible.

[flagged]

Please list the countries that have been "destroyed" by NATO specifically.

Re: Linus Torvalds comments on the Russian Linux maintainers being delisted

#173

Post by nataliste »

aguaviva wrote: post #159
nataliste wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is more of a you problem than a me problem. Perhaps you should try not to reduce arguments to less than 200 characters, but I suspect it's uncontrollable due to longterm Twitter usage given your particular patois.

As long as I am summarizing your thesis accurately, I see no problem at all. As it happens, I haven't intentionally read anything on Twitter for well over a decade. But if it is helpful for you to simply assume that, should anyone care to question your deep, penetrating analysis of recent human history and its impact on current events today; and even worse, fail to appreciate your enthusiasm for run-on paragraphs ful…

>[...] peppered with fancy latin idioms (for style I guess) [...]

I honestly don't think you understand the thesis or have the historical understanding to do so. This accusation of using Latin for rhetorical purposes is an admission of this. You could've asked yourself "Do I understand the significance of Carthago delenda est in this context? Could I ask for clarification?" No, you just made a sophistic jibe, twice.

There's no substance to the rest of your rant, so I'll kindly request for you to read and use Paul Graham's How to Disagree[1].

[1] https://paulgraham.com/disagree.html

Re: Linus Torvalds comments on the Russian Linux maintainers being delisted

#174

Post by gus_massa »

est wrote: post #102
gus_massa wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Removing all the old contributions is probably impossible. IIUC in case they want to contribute, they must send the patch to the new maintainer of that part of Linux, instead of sending it directly to Linus.

omg it's a hot buzz in non-tech circles. People thought Russians are no longer be able to participate or using Linux.

participate: It's still not 100% clear, but I guess they still can send patchs (or fork the project).

using: It's GPL2. Everyone can use it, nobody can add restrictions. (Some people think this is a feature and some that it's a bug.)

Re: Linus Torvalds comments on the Russian Linux maintainers being delisted

#175

Post by mipsi »

yehat wrote: post #166
mipsi wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You missed the point, he didn't mention history in general, but specifically "Finnish history". In this respect it's not about British colonialism but more about about Russian imperialism / Stalinism (see Russo-Finnish war 1939).

Did he just now realized that history? For over 30 years accepting contributions from the "enemy"? Then when the history is employed, how about he as a Finn bans also Swedish contributors?

Did you just realized that Torvald is not racist or anti-russian at all? He didn't block any russian maintainers until today (more than 2 years after russia turning genocidal imperial again).

Re: Linus Torvalds comments on the Russian Linux maintainers being delisted

#176

Post by mipsi »

pphysch wrote: post #158
scoofy wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you want perfect fairness for bullies, not victims, then you don’t actually care about victims at all. This whataboutism is a circular argument where any brazen invasion can be justified by some previous perceived slight. Because someone somewhere got away with something, now anything is permissible.

[flagged]

There has never been an "unprovoked aggression against Yugoslavia". More than 130K people were killed and 4 million displaced (mainly by Serb troops) and people begged for an intervention, which came to late (think about Sarajevo, Srebrenica).

It doesn't fit your narrative.

Re: Linus Torvalds comments on the Russian Linux maintainers being delisted

#178

Post by Jomamadidit »

scoofy wrote: post #146
sundarurfriend wrote: post #82

If this was purely because of sanctions, this could have been handled much more gracefully. But it's clear from Linus' comments that he just doesn't respect these volunteers because they happen to be from a particular country. > I'm Finnish. ... Apparently it's not just lack of real news, it's lack of history knowledge too. If we're suddenly taking history as a criterion, half of the world should ban British develope…

Russia invaded it’s neighbor. These sanctions are one of the consequences. It sucks for the good-faith programmers in Russia but what would you have the rest of the world do? The Russian state must be sanctioned for its blatant disregard for international norms. Please don’t just respond with whataboutism. The whataboutism in these threads involves different people in different times. This is happening now.

[flagged]

Re: Linus Torvalds comments on the Russian Linux maintainers being delisted

#179

Post by Jomamadidit »

scoofy wrote: post #152
pphysch wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't invoke "international norms" and then in the very next paragraph "but no talking about precedent, that would be whataboutism". Norms are established through precedents. There are considerable precedents in the 21st century that military invasions DO NOT lead to international sanctions. So this isn't a valid argument, and it's true that that decision was emotional and politically motivated.

It’s a perfectly valid argument. All invasions are generally bad, some worse than others. And, yes, some perpetrators of unjust invasions are punished worse than others. The idea that you turn a conversation about fairness for victims into a conversation about fairness for bullies means you don’t actually care about victims.

[flagged]
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