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Windows 8 Pro Upgrade to cost $39.99

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Re: Windows 8 Pro Upgrade to cost $39.99

#181

I have a hard time imagining that many Windows 7 users are eager to upgrade to Windows 8 on their desktops and laptops, given the drastic changes catering to touch interaction, bringing them little apparent value at best, and significant lost productivity and frustration at worst. My Windows 7 box is for gaming and productivity (not necessarily in that order), and after all I've seen of it, I wouldn't touch Windows 8…

Have you actually used Windows 8? I don't make much use of the metro apps, but there are lots of smaller improvements that I appreciate, like the new task manager, file copy dialog, login screen, etc. The sight of the new start screen incites revulsion in most power users, but try to remember that you won't be spending much time there. Treat the start screen like what it really is: a fancier start menu. Like me, you'…

I installed Win8 last night on an old PC (Core 2 Duo 2.5GHz, 4GB RAM) with mouse and keyboard. I'm an OS X user and hate Windows with a passion, but I honestly, really wanted to enjoy Windows 8 and wanted it to be good (not that I would ever use it; but it would stop OS X from going more mainstream which is a good thing cause Apple can still "innovate" if not 95% of PCs are running Lion).

It was bad. So bad I can't articulate its dreadfulness...

Animations were jumpy, to open an app that's not in the "start screen" you have to right click and press some button to go to another screen, to switch apps you have to hover your mouse on top-left corner and wait 400ms for the list of open apps, there's no way to "search" for apps.

If you're in the (classic) desktop mode, you have to click on bottom-left to go back to start screen, then right click on the screen and click on "more" and manually select the app you want to open.

It took me 3 minutes to find a way to turn off the damn thing (you must hover on top-right, wait for a kinda contextual menu, go to "Settings -> Power -> Turn Off".

I played an AVI movie, and the default player (I don't know what it was, but didn't look like Windows Media Player) was sooo bad it's not even funny. Whenever you move the mouse, on-screen controls appear and you have to right click two times to get rid of them, and I think there were no volume controls either. And by on-screen controls, I mean on-screen, in the sense that it dims your movie, places a gigantic status bar and some buttons in the center of the screen, and doesn't respond to keyboard commands.

The PowerShell is a joke. I accidentally right clicked on it and for exactly 2 minutes, it was displaying errors. Even simple commands like "ls" were slow (like you're using telnet on a dial-up modem).

Internet Explorer was very nice.

The Finder (don't remember what it's called on Windows) was much better, but that Microsoft Office 2007-like bar on top was a little buggy and confusing (You click on items to open it, but if you want to close it, you can't click on the same items again. You have to click on a button that's appeared in the right side).

I'm an Apple fan, but I can assure you, I really, really did want Win 8 to be good, even though I would never use it. But it was worse than what I expected, and now I'm certain that it'll be worse than Vista for MS. After all, when someone like me (who was an advanced Windows user up until 4-5 years ago, and is very comfortable with computers) was confused by the changes and the stupid UI (with many mistakes is usability), how would average users react to it?

Re: Windows 8 Pro Upgrade to cost $39.99

#182
post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My guess is that it will take a long, long time for enterprises to move to Windows 8, with most sticking with Windows 7 for as long as Microsoft continues to provide security patches for it. If you're an enterprise with 10000 or 50000 non-technical users running Windows 7, the cost of moving to Windows 8 will be primarily IT staff hours, including all the support questions from users puzzled by the new user interface…

I don't disagree with you, but this is the exact argument I've heard with every Microsoft OS since windows 2000 (and no doubt it was made before then, too).

2000 was a real leap forward. Everything since wasn't. I'd still be running windows 2000 if it ran on my hardware (and my software ran on it). I've never directly paid for a post-2000 version of windows, only got it on new hardware.

Re: Windows 8 Pro Upgrade to cost $39.99

#183
post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would you use the start menu to get a run dialog? Windows key + R I haven't had any performance problems while running games with search indexing on. This laptop doesn't even use SSD.

Anything you need a Run dialog for, you can just press the Windows key and start typing. Everything in your path shows up, with "recently used" suggestions on the right side, and quick feedback if you mistype something.

The Unity Dash in Ubuntu (12.04) works the exact same way.

I'd be curious to see if they lifted this from Ubuntu, or the other way around.

It's a bit of an adjustment, but after a couple of days of usage opening a Run dialog just feels so primitive.

Re: Windows 8 Pro Upgrade to cost $39.99

#184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you actually used Windows 8? I don't make much use of the metro apps, but there are lots of smaller improvements that I appreciate, like the new task manager, file copy dialog, login screen, etc. The sight of the new start screen incites revulsion in most power users, but try to remember that you won't be spending much time there. Treat the start screen like what it really is: a fancier start menu. Like me, you'…

I installed Win8 last night on an old PC (Core 2 Duo 2.5GHz, 4GB RAM) with mouse and keyboard. I'm an OS X user and hate Windows with a passion, but I honestly, really wanted to enjoy Windows 8 and wanted it to be good (not that I would ever use it; but it would stop OS X from going more mainstream which is a good thing cause Apple can still "innovate" if not 95% of PCs are running Lion). It was bad . So bad I can't…

The choppy animations can be due to your GPU (intel?) or driver. FWIW I do not experience choppiness with the Release Preview + Intel HD3000 (MBA 2011).

To open an app that is not in the start screen, type its name. This also searches for apps.

Switching apps can be done with Win-tab or Alt-tab

Use the winkey to go to the startscreen.

Winkey+I = Settings

There are a lot of other shortcuts.

PowerShell 3 (ISE and normal command window) are pretty quick for me. What errors did you get?

Agree with you on the default video player. These apps still need a lot of work. Media Player is still there. VLC and XBMC are just a download away.

Re: Windows 8 Pro Upgrade to cost $39.99

#185
post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not the most frequent method for launching. According to MS, their metrics indicate pinned task bar items are, or are trending to be, the most frequent method. When I don't remember the name of the thing I want to launch (which is quite frequent), I rely mostly on positional navigation through a customized start menu. That is, I don't remember programs by name, I remember them by where I left them. Windows Vista…

For most people the "All Programs" menu quickly turns into a circus. Curating it is a chore. They are messing this up in Windows 8, as every time you install a application, including desktop applications, all of its start menu items get pinned onto the start screen. I'm afraid most users will never bother to unpin them.

This is sensible legacy behaviour. Future installers should be a bit smarter about pinning.

Re: Windows 8 Pro Upgrade to cost $39.99

#186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I installed Win8 last night on an old PC (Core 2 Duo 2.5GHz, 4GB RAM) with mouse and keyboard. I'm an OS X user and hate Windows with a passion, but I honestly, really wanted to enjoy Windows 8 and wanted it to be good (not that I would ever use it; but it would stop OS X from going more mainstream which is a good thing cause Apple can still "innovate" if not 95% of PCs are running Lion). It was bad . So bad I can't…

The choppy animations can be due to your GPU (intel?) or driver. FWIW I do not experience choppiness with the Release Preview + Intel HD3000 (MBA 2011). To open an app that is not in the start screen, type its name. This also searches for apps. Switching apps can be done with Win-tab or Alt-tab Use the winkey to go to the startscreen. Winkey+I = Settings There are a lot of other shortcuts. PowerShell 3 (ISE and norma…

Thanks for your response. As I'm a Mac user, I'd completely forgotten about the WinKey. And now that I think about it, I guess it was silly of me not to try alt,win-tab.

The jumpiness I was mentioning is hard to explain. But it's not my graphics card, I'm sure. Most animations are just fine, but when you 'snap' an app from the top and drag it to the middle, there's an odd jumpiness in the way the window scales up. In 150ms, it goes from 20% to 50%, then instantly (less than 10ms) scales to 90% and then it takes another 100ms to fill the screen. It's just not natural IMO.

But, still, I guess most (naive) Windows users aren't familiar with WinKey and alt,win-tab and must be "educated" beforehand, and that could be tough for Microsoft to do adequately, and it could lose them significant market share. Win8 on a tablet is of course completely a different situation and could be nice and pleasant.

With your shortcuts, I think I can manage to use Win8 (for the very limited tasks that I need it, a few times a week) after all. Thanks a lot!

Re: Windows 8 Pro Upgrade to cost $39.99

#187
post #14

I wouldn't chalk this up as just a competitive response to the relatively low price Apple charges for its OS upgrades. I think Microsoft really wants/needs to accelerate the adoption of Windows 8 even if that means taking a hit on license fees. Whatever they can do to accelerate adoption of W8 in the enterprise and consumer markets will more than pay off in the long-term. A major reduction in legacy support requireme…

Less a competive thing. More a looking at what Apple is doing and why and then taking what they think will work better. Validates Apple's approach.

Did MS ever make much money on upgrades?

Re: Windows 8 Pro Upgrade to cost $39.99

#188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Since the first OSX, all upgrades were point upgrades and all of them were very significant. They were also more frequent than Windows upgrades.

You put point upgrades and significant in the same sentence. Just saying...

The upgrade between Snow Leopard and Lion was a point upgrade. Every OSX release is a 10.x release.

Re: Windows 8 Pro Upgrade to cost $39.99

#189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can install the MS upgrades on a blank hdd too, can't you? It's been some years but I thought they just used to ask for a disk from the "qualifying upgrade" product to be inserted during install.

Usually, you can do following: - Install Windows retail SKU, but do not activate it. You can borrow disk or download ISO for this. - Start installing upgrade version, then reformat partition, supplying upgrade key in the process. At the end, you will have Windows upgrade installed and activated, fully functional.

Wait, you install the old Windows version, then the upgrade, and then reformat? That doesn't sound right to me...

Re: Windows 8 Pro Upgrade to cost $39.99

#190
post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And what's to say that consumers will switch? It's not like the PC market is experiencing any growth. Sure consumers who feel they have to own a Windows PC will upgrade when they're existing hardware dies, but I'm skeptical that users will be queuing up to by a Windows 8 PC on launch day. And home users just don't upgrade existing hardware in any meaningful quantity.

PC market as viewed separate from tablet market is not experience much growth but when combined, they are growing. Don't forget that Microsoft is targeting the tablet market with this release as well.

What on earth are you talking about? This like saying "Linux doesn't have a very big stake on the desktop, but if you include its competitor windows, then its stake is pretty large".

The reason tablets are separated from the PC market is because tablets are a different and competing product! And make no mistake, this OS price is not for tablets. What Metro tablet am I going to buy that doesn't... have metro on it?

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