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The IPv6 Transition

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Re: The IPv6 Transition

#271

Post by PhilipRoman »

abhinavk wrote: post #256
PhilipRoman wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Security - not really, but to be honest CG-NAT is kind of nice for privacy. I don't have to worry about leaking a (by default) permanent identifier. Once/if I go full ipv6, I'll probably start using a VPN full time.

The IP that you use to connect outside is separate and not permanent by default. AFAIK both Windows 11 and Linux generate a new one every day.

AFAIK it is within the same /64, which for all tracking purposes means "the same ip". The CG-NAT ip on the other hand is not even unique at any particular moment, let alone permanently. Kind of like having your own free residential VPN.

Re: The IPv6 Transition

#272

Post by GoblinSlayer »

ktosobcy wrote: post #205
lmm wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The only practically useful thing about my IPv6 enabled network is that I can run globally routable services on my lan, without NAT port mapping. Of course, only if the client is also IPv6. A couple of other practically useful things: - You never get address collisions when connecting to someone else's VPN, or connecting to your home network via VPN from someone else's private network (if you've set that up) - If t…

so for anyone that "just browses the web" (which is overwhelming majority) there is virtually no difference/benefit? I don't play online games, don't use VPN, have a couple of services on my local RPi that has port forwarded on router and that's it... ipv6 could be handy when testing some service on my laptop and trying with external services but this happens so rarely that it's not an issue... on the flipside, whene…

No gaming allowed. In true communism you don't need entertainment, because you love your job.

Re: The IPv6 Transition

#273

Post by orbisvicis »

Animats wrote: post #20

China's IPv6 transition is 74% complete.[1] Conversion to IPv6 was specifically called out in China's 14th Five Year Plan, which gives the goal high visibility within the government and the Party. Conversion is quite far along. The current goal is everything IPv6 enabled by 2025, IPv4 turns off in 2030. 99% of the top 100 mobile applications in China are on IPv6. China Mobile's backbone is now IPv6 only. [1] https://…

US Dept. of Commerce mandates the same:

https://www.commerce.gov/about/policies/ipv6-policy

Re: The IPv6 Transition

#274

Post by ktosobcy »

GoblinSlayer wrote: post #272
ktosobcy wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

so for anyone that "just browses the web" (which is overwhelming majority) there is virtually no difference/benefit? I don't play online games, don't use VPN, have a couple of services on my local RPi that has port forwarded on router and that's it... ipv6 could be handy when testing some service on my laptop and trying with external services but this happens so rarely that it's not an issue... on the flipside, whene…

No gaming allowed. In true communism you don't need entertainment, because you love your job.

what? the world doesn't end with fortnite or whatever brain-rot is currently popular (on utterly locked up platform with excessive anti-cheat)... there is a gazzilion of super entertaining games that you can play locally... :shrug:

Re: The IPv6 Transition

#275

Post by pmarreck »

hairyplanter wrote: post #10

I have fully implemented IPv6 in my home network. I have even implemented an IPv6-Only network. It fully works, including accessing IPv4 only websites like github.com via DNS64 and NAT64 at my router. The only practically useful thing about my IPv6 enabled network is that I can run globally routable services on my lan, without NAT port mapping. Of course, only if the client is also IPv6. Other than this one use case,…

Don't forget that Hetzner and other hosts are also charging extra for IPv4 addresses now, while IPv6 is free.

Also, you're speaking from the privileged perspective of a first-world country- many other countries missed the boat on IPv4 addresses and are limited to IPv6, which also probably explains why global uptake continues upwards despite the US stagnating.

I have never gotten github access from my IPv6-only Hetzner-hosted machine. I don't have control over their router(s) and I am not an experienced network admin who would know how to set up something that would let me simply fucking "git clone" from that machine. I would end up having to set up something janky. The fact that Github is IPv4-only in 2024 is atrociously bad and hopefully handing over business hand-over-fist to their closed-source and open-source competitors.

I love having access to all my internal machines over IPv6 from anywhere without having to use janky hacks. I'd be able to self-host boutique and portfolio websites for example (at least from IPv6-enabled clients), without having to use (and pay for) an external host just for the sake of access.

The fact that hotels and work LANs don't permit access is a "hotel and work LAN" problem, as well as a chicken-and-egg one. If enough people request it (perhaps work people want some cheap Hetzner hosts for dev environments and traveling devs want access to the same machines), the Sysops That Be will make it happen- They are certainly educated enough in the space to enable it.

You are neglecting the cost savings and the non-Western perspective, as well as the "simple developer, not devops expert" perspective.

Re: The IPv6 Transition

#276

Post by pmarreck »

lucw wrote: post #170
kijin wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it was a real problem, market pricing would reflect the increasing severity of that problem. The truth is that people who care about port forwarding are such a small minority -- especially now that P2P file sharing has lost its hype -- that they don't make a visible dent in the rate of IPv4 exhaustion.

In practice the tech giants such as Google, Apple and Microsoft will dictate adoption of technology. When Chrome starts mandating or heavily recommending IPv6, adoption will reach 99% overnight. That's what happened with https: https://www.znetlive.com/blog/google-chrome-68-mandates-http...

One can only hope.

Either this or a "killer app" use-case that requires IPv6 will push it forward significantly, IMHO.

Re: The IPv6 Transition

#277

Post by GoblinSlayer »

immibis wrote: post #227
megous wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's no minimum subnet size.

/64 acts as a soft limit due to the prevalence of SLAAC. Which is good in a way, since it means ISPs have to give out at least /64, which means you're always able to subnet (although you can't use SLAAC and must use static addresses or DHCP) unlike IPv4 where you have to pay for extra addresses.

The purpose of SLAAC intends to have many customers in one /64 network though.

Re: The IPv6 Transition

#278

Post by pmarreck »

efitz wrote: post #239
kijin wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If it was a real problem, market pricing would reflect the increasing severity of that problem. The truth is that people who care about port forwarding are such a small minority -- especially now that P2P file sharing has lost its hype -- that they don't make a visible dent in the rate of IPv4 exhaustion.

Why was this downvoted? It’s exactly right. The reason that IPv6 is so lightly used is that it’s cheaper to use IPv4 + workarounds. I’m not saying this is a good thing or a bad thing, or making any value judgment about IPv4 vs IPv6. People and businesses don’t spend money on technology upgrades where the benefit is not measurably better than what they already have. This is just common sense; no one wants to throw awa…

> The reason that IPv6 is so lightly used is that it’s cheaper to use IPv4 + workarounds

Cheaper? Hetzner and other hosts give IPv6 addresses out for free and charge extra for IPv4 addresses.

Re: The IPv6 Transition

#279

Post by alwayslikethis »

orangeboats wrote: post #252
PhilipRoman wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Security - not really, but to be honest CG-NAT is kind of nice for privacy. I don't have to worry about leaking a (by default) permanent identifier. Once/if I go full ipv6, I'll probably start using a VPN full time.

Conversely, CGNAT also means that if someone in your neighbourhood decided to be a malicious actor, you will likely be affected too.

For law enforcement purposes most CGNAT operators should keep a log of who had what address at what time. You can still get blocked by websites until you get a new address, though.

Re: The IPv6 Transition

#280

Post by GoblinSlayer »

ktosobcy wrote: post #274
GoblinSlayer wrote: post #272

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No gaming allowed. In true communism you don't need entertainment, because you love your job.

what? the world doesn't end with fortnite or whatever brain-rot is currently popular (on utterly locked up platform with excessive anti-cheat)... there is a gazzilion of super entertaining games that you can play locally... :shrug:

False dichotomy. Quake 3 can be played locally and over network.
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