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#BoycottApple trending on Google plus due to Galaxy Nexus ban

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Re: #BoycottApple trending on Google plus due to Galaxy Nexus ban

#181

This is really a non-issue. Tech companies sue each other and get import bans all the time. The victim eventually moves some UI widget three pixels to the right and the import ban is lifted and life moves on. The only real consequence of all this is that lawyers on both sides make a lot of money. Google is not going to stop making Android and Apple is not going to stop making iOS. Both will just advance more slowly b…

Have you considered that while for huge conglomerates such as Samsung and companies like Apple this is a mere game for their law departments, it's much more serious for the small developer? Big corporations could pretty much shut down any start up if they wanted to. The reverse is not true. Could Panic Software have sued Apple because of the Audion / iTunes story? So what good is the patent law if it only benefits th…

I don't know if Panic had any patents regarding this.

The patent system doesn't really benefit the small developer. I was listening to Build & Analyze and Marco Arment was asked if he would patent features of Instapaper and he essentially said that it is more pain than it's worth. They don't have time time and money required to enforce it.

Re: #BoycottApple trending on Google plus due to Galaxy Nexus ban

#182

I'm wondering what kind of institutional respect for IP and spirit of innovation would lead Samsung to whip up this UI? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MGxYZXjXozc Sure, one can argue that Samsung and Apple both look to a common ancestor for their ideas, but I think Samsung is more insidious than people are willing to admit here.

The Galaxy Nexus doesn't use / have that.

Re: #BoycottApple trending on Google plus due to Galaxy Nexus ban

#183

I'm wondering what kind of institutional respect for IP and spirit of innovation would lead Samsung to whip up this UI? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MGxYZXjXozc Sure, one can argue that Samsung and Apple both look to a common ancestor for their ideas, but I think Samsung is more insidious than people are willing to admit here.

The Galaxy Nexus doesn't use / have that.

I'm not saying it does. I'm saying Samsung has no shame in copying this closely.

Re: #BoycottApple trending on Google plus due to Galaxy Nexus ban

#184

Something about Koh's overwhelming bias for Apple seems really suspicious. It's one thing to preeminently ban sales of product A for reason X, but to also ban sales of product B for reason Y where products A and B have the same parent, and where reasons X and Y are completely unrelated? Something is wrong with this picture. What else could be going on? Maybe I have a cynical view of humanity, but I spent a few minute…

If you are accusing her of bribery, that is a very serious allegation. Imagine if such a thing happens and is eventually exposed. What a scandal would it be. I don't think any large company, let alone Apple, would want to be involved in any such mess.

It is completely reasonable to investigate bribery where there is a perceived unreasonable decision and a heavy financial motive.

Individuals working at large companies do bribe people in a variety of situations.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/30/business/wal-mart-bribery-...

Re: #BoycottApple trending on Google plus due to Galaxy Nexus ban

#185

I'm wondering what kind of institutional respect for IP and spirit of innovation would lead Samsung to whip up this UI? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MGxYZXjXozc Sure, one can argue that Samsung and Apple both look to a common ancestor for their ideas, but I think Samsung is more insidious than people are willing to admit here.

I'm not sure what that has to do with the most recent injunction against the Samsung Galaxy Nexus. The judge issued the injunction on the strength of U.S. Patent 8,086,604, which "provides convenient access to items of information that are related to various descriptors input by a user, by means of a unitary interface which is capable of accessing information in a variety of locations, through a number of different techniques". The infringing technology is specifically called out as Android's Quick Search Box, which has been present for years.

The Apple patent in question is obvious on its face. Off the top of my head, Google Desktop Search, which was released a month or so before Apple filed for the patent, is prior art. Nat Friedman's Dashboard project (http://nat.org/dashboard/) represents significantly more advanced prior art and predates Apple's patent filing by over a year.

Samsung may be insidious, but that's not the issue at play here. The judge ruled that Google's Quick Search Box violates an Apple patent that should never have been issued, and represents a toe hold to go after Android as a whole. This is a farce.

Re: #BoycottApple trending on Google plus due to Galaxy Nexus ban

#186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Korea Samsung sells cars that are almost exact copies if American and German models. Korean businesses have no qualms about straight up stealing others designs. For example looking at this car, by a company called Ssangyang, http://www.jeepfan.com/readersjeeps/ians-korando/ it's an almost perfect clone of a Jeep CJ-7. This is exceptionally common with Korean Chaebols. Samsung getting sympathy over this is laughabl…

Well, to be fair, one of the main reasons for Asia's growth the last decades is exactly the blatant disregard for patents and copyright. Sure, it may feel unfair to the original creators of the products, but it sure has forced them to continually innovate. I'd actually argue that cloning is a positive (as long as you differentiate it sufficiently, don't clone a BMW and call it a BWV) thing for the world. In my opinio…

I agree that the copycats who "do it cheaper" do drive innovation at some level, however, the reason they can do it cheaper is that they've invested almost nothing into developing the product, other than reverse-engineering costs. For example, no one was doing a multitouch screen for a consumer mobile device until Apple. In fact, companies such as RIM where declaring the full QWERTY hardware keyboards were the future of smartphones. So Apple took a risk, a huge risk in fact. So when a company like Samsung (or any in their cohort) comes along and puts a touchscreen on a phone, when no one else was doing it before, Samsung effectively benefited from Apple's risk. I'm not arguing that the concept of a touchscreen should be patent-protected, however the specific technology behind should be.

Furthermore, part of Samsung's complaint against the injunction is that the iPad design patent is "generic" and should not be subject to protection, yet if it was so generic, then why wasn't anyone else using that design before Apple? Just because it's minimal doesn't mean it's generic. It appears generic because the iPad became so ubiquitous. Coca-Cola bottles are another good example of the logic behind a design patent. The Coca-Cola's classic "Contour" bottle, or "Hobble skirt" bottle, from 1915 was one of the first glass containers ever to be patented based only on its unique shape. In 1916, Coca-Cola debuted the patented bottle which would help distinguish them from competitors. Even today, that bottle is recognized as a "Coke bottle." No one is arguing that bottles should be patent protected, but the specific characteristics that make a bottle unique certainly should be. The Coke bottle is a prime example.

Design patents protect that which distinguishes one product from another.

If you look at this image: http://www.zdnet.co.uk/i/z5/illo/nw/story_graphics/10oct/gal...

The products look almost identical, although the Galaxy pictured is the smaller version than the 10.1. But really.. who in their right mind can say that Samsung just happened to come up with the exact same design as Apple. More importantly, would the neighbor down the street, if she saw them both together, be able to tell them apart? She's likely say, "Oh cool, Apple made a smaller iPad."

For more examples of Samsung blatantly ripping off Apple designs, have a look at this: http://www.iclarified.com/images/news/20889/74763/74763.jpg

Samsung copied the exact same green for the phone icon as well as positioned it in the exact same default location as the iPhone. The clock icon is a square clock with a round face with a slight change of shading. The Notes/Memo icon is virtually identical expect the Samsung version is slightly zoomed out. The similarities continue through Galaxy products. The web browser icon even (at least a year ago) had a compass on it!

I am not a fan of RIM equipment by any stretch, but at least they designed their own icons without ripping off Apple: http://geekynotes.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/blackb...

Even the Samsung box design was copied from Apple.

Samsung box: http://www.thegalaxytab.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/10/galax...

Apple box: http://admintell.napco.com/ee/images/uploads/appletell/ipad-...

For comparison, here's a Sony box: http://www.taragis.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/Sony-Table...

We, the tech minded can argue differences, but that isn't at issue. Of course a tech person knows the difference between a Samsung Galaxy XYZ123 and an XYZ321, but the average person that sees that Samsung product is going to certainly confuse it with Apple.

Arguing that this injunction is somehow stifling innovation is bullshit. Samsung themselves are stiffing their own innovation trying to create a copycat product and riding the Apple gravy train as opposed to inventing something of their own. At least Amazon, Sony, HP, Microsoft are/were attempting to distinguish themselves. I respect the vapor-ware MS Surface far more than the extant Samsung Galaxy simply because at least Microsoft is trying to innovate, even if they seem to have a rough time of it. THAT'S what competition is about, not copying someone's designs and tweaking it a little. It's about building a better product than the other guy. Microsoft, and it pains me to say it, is one of the few companies other than Apple that are truly trying to innovate in the mobile device space. Samsung is just another East-Asian mega-conglomerate trying to cash in on someone else's work. In 2010, Samsung's revenue (not including subsidiaries outside of Korea) was $258 billion. Apple's was $63.5 Billion. I mention that because the anti-Apple narrative is that somehow they are bullying poor little Samsung when that just isn't the case. Samsung is the number 2 patent holder by number of patents globally, just after IBM and just ahead of Canon. Microsoft comes in at number 6. And Apple -- number 39. RIM is number 40.

To make Apple out as the villan in this saga is ridiculous. Maybe we don't like Apple because their SDK offends us or our neo-hipster aesthetic is offended by the ubiquitousness of their products, but in this case, Samsung is getting exactly what they deserve.

People that want to turn this into an Android vs. Apple battle are missing the point of the injunction, nor did they read the filings in the case. If this were an Android/Apple battle, it would be Google in the courtroom.

Re: #BoycottApple trending on Google plus due to Galaxy Nexus ban

#187
post #63

Google would do the same if they were in Apple's position. So boycotting does not make sense.

That is clearly untrue. When Apple wanted to make a phone they made their ecosystem a jail cell.

When Google was in the same position and wanted to make a phone, they started the Open Handset Alliance, and developed free software for manufactures and consumers to use and modify as they see fit.

How exactly is that doing the same thing?

Re: #BoycottApple trending on Google plus due to Galaxy Nexus ban

#188

Perhaps Samsung will consider not slavishly copying Apple design for their next products?

I am genuinely confused by this. Definitely, the original Galaxy S could be mistaken for an iPhone 3GS. And the SGSII was black and rectangular with a similar speaker grill so I suppose there are some similarities (though I don't think anyone who can recognise that not all touch screen phones are iPhones will confuse the two), but seriously, the Galaxy Nexus looks nothing at all like any iPhone. It runs stock Android, not Touchwiz, which, again, could not be confused with iOS by anyone with any knowledge about smartphones.

Re: #BoycottApple trending on Google plus due to Galaxy Nexus ban

#189
post #164
post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

on reddit however...

If you actually used Reddit you would notice that most ignorant and outright trollish comments are downvoted into oblivion. You see a lot more awful comments, but that's only because Reddit is larger. They're treated the same.

Not if you make a comment like "iSuck, but I think I am better that everyone" on r/technology. I wish your description were true everywhere.

Re: #BoycottApple trending on Google plus due to Galaxy Nexus ban

#190
post #185

I'm wondering what kind of institutional respect for IP and spirit of innovation would lead Samsung to whip up this UI? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MGxYZXjXozc Sure, one can argue that Samsung and Apple both look to a common ancestor for their ideas, but I think Samsung is more insidious than people are willing to admit here.

I'm not sure what that has to do with the most recent injunction against the Samsung Galaxy Nexus. The judge issued the injunction on the strength of U.S. Patent 8,086,604, which "provides convenient access to items of information that are related to various descriptors input by a user, by means of a unitary interface which is capable of accessing information in a variety of locations, through a number of different t…

I don't feel that this lawsuit is specifically over the four patents in question and only the four patents in question. It's punishment (in the game theoretical sense) for Samsung's institutional attitude. Obviously the discourse here has taken on import beyond the purely legal realities and into a more moral conversation about right and wrong. Morally speaking, I feel that many of Samsung's design decisions are wrong. This isn't to say that Apple is totally clean either, but it bears mentioning that the "victim" here has no problem with seeing how much copying it can get away with, and I see no problem with its getting punished for it once in a while.
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