Facebook e-mail mess: Address books altered, e-mail lost • Hacker News Board

Re: Facebook e-mail mess: Address books altered, e-mail lost

#131

Post by Splines » Sun, Jul 01, 2012, 5:51 AM UTC

SwellJoe wrote: post #110

Facebook simply doesn't have an ethical central core. They've shown over and over that when user privacy or security conflict with facebook's goals, they'll choose facebook over the user. It's always relatively subtle; they strive to only do what they can get away with...but it's always pushing the line, and is never based on trying to do what's right, merely avoiding backlash. Facebook, the company, is kind of a soc…

> I have several friends within facebook whom I like and respect, and they produce a lot of great technology.

I find this idea interesting. Can an entity like a corporation have a life beyond that which is given to it by its employees? Like the ship of theseus, can you replace all employees and still have a business that "feels" the same?

Re: Facebook e-mail mess: Address books altered, e-mail lost

#132

Post by machrider » Sun, Jul 01, 2012, 5:57 AM UTC

sugarmountain wrote: post #95

fl3tch wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, "Knowingly accesses and without permission... uses any data" would make the accessing and transmission of contacts (a la Path and many other apps) illegal. Except there's probably a clause somewhere that you agreed to without reading which lets them do that, and the same may be true here.

While it's probably true that the EULA permits FB to read the contact list, and update it in expected ways, there are many points covered in those statutes: interception and destruction of data, making the system unavailable for its intended use, etc. Can anyone find language permitting FB to destructively alter the contents in profoundly unusual ways so that email is redirected to FB servers for interception and del…

Not sure about criminal charges, but at the very least, it seems like a negligent act resulting in real damages to many people. I don't think a class-action lawsuit is out of the question.

Re: Facebook e-mail mess: Address books altered, e-mail lost

#133

Post by skybrian » Sun, Jul 01, 2012, 5:59 AM UTC

As I understand it, when an email address on Facebook gets synced to a phone, that's just a cache. Any updates to the email address on Facebook automatically update the cache. When friends update their email addresses, the cache gets overwritten and you don't have their old addresses anymore.

But now, Facebook changed people's email addresses without their permission. The cache gets updated, and boom, the old address is gone.

But what makes it more scary is that people don't actually remember that they originally got the address from Facebook and they don't understand the caching behavior. All they know is that the old address is gone. So they think that email addresses that they didn't get from Facebook are also at risk.

The workaround is to manually copy email addresses from Facebook to some other system. Any email addresses you get from Facebook by automatically syncing aren't safe.

It's a pity; after all, most of the point of the system is that you shouldn't have to manually update your address book when your friends change their contact info.

Re: Facebook e-mail mess: Address books altered, e-mail lost

#134

Post by chris_wot » Sun, Jul 01, 2012, 6:03 AM UTC

horsehead wrote: post #94

horsehead wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So I hold an opinion and do have substantial intellectual abilities. Does that mean I must be erudite in every post? <-- rhetorical answer because the answer is an assumed "No."

Lolz. Even a reasonable post gets downvoted. Now I'm just itching for downvotes. GIVE ME THEM.

I think you are being downvoted because none of your posts are reasonable or add to the discussion on HN. For example, you asked if all your posts must be erudite, and you believe that the obvious answer to your question is "no".

Basically, when you can't even answer your own rhetorical questions correctly, then it's pretty much all downhill from there.

Re: Facebook e-mail mess: Address books altered, e-mail lost

#135

Post by tedunangst » Sun, Jul 01, 2012, 6:07 AM UTC

SwellJoe wrote: post #129

orijing wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you elaborate on why you think in this specific case user privacy or security conflict with Facebook's goals?

It seems obvious, to me, but I guess I'll spell it out: Facebook wants access to your email so badly that they're willing to steal it. This is, in my opinion, among the worst things they've ever done for user privacy (and security, but mostly privacy in this case), in a long list of subtle, and not-so-subtle tactics. It also has very real security consequences. The automatic contact list updates for potentially milli…

passwords for other sites

Wait, seriously? People are using websites where the password reset emails are being sent from somebody's Droid phone? I think you've gotten a little carried away.

Re: Facebook e-mail mess: Address books altered, e-mail lost

#136

Post by tedunangst » Sun, Jul 01, 2012, 6:16 AM UTC

skybrian wrote: post #133

As I understand it, when an email address on Facebook gets synced to a phone, that's just a cache. Any updates to the email address on Facebook automatically update the cache. When friends update their email addresses, the cache gets overwritten and you don't have their old addresses anymore. But now, Facebook changed people's email addresses without their permission. The cache gets updated, and boom, the old address…

That's an excellent explanation. It also fits the mold of just about every other "service X broke into service Y and stole my info" story, wherein people forget lots of other plausible explanations.

Re: Facebook e-mail mess: Address books altered, e-mail lost

#137

Post by thezilch » Sun, Jul 01, 2012, 6:16 AM UTC

tedunangst wrote: post #135

SwellJoe wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems obvious, to me, but I guess I'll spell it out: Facebook wants access to your email so badly that they're willing to steal it. This is, in my opinion, among the worst things they've ever done for user privacy (and security, but mostly privacy in this case), in a long list of subtle, and not-so-subtle tactics. It also has very real security consequences. The automatic contact list updates for potentially milli…

passwords for other sites Wait, seriously? People are using websites where the password reset emails are being sent from somebody's Droid phone? I think you've gotten a little carried away.

Ever seen sites with the ability to connect via Facebook? It often grants said site(s) with the user's Facebook primary-email. Now all personal emails, including password recoveries, are going through Facebook for said site(s).

Re: Facebook e-mail mess: Address books altered, e-mail lost

#138

Post by SwellJoe » Sun, Jul 01, 2012, 6:18 AM UTC

tedunangst wrote: post #135

SwellJoe wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It seems obvious, to me, but I guess I'll spell it out: Facebook wants access to your email so badly that they're willing to steal it. This is, in my opinion, among the worst things they've ever done for user privacy (and security, but mostly privacy in this case), in a long list of subtle, and not-so-subtle tactics. It also has very real security consequences. The automatic contact list updates for potentially milli…

passwords for other sites Wait, seriously? People are using websites where the password reset emails are being sent from somebody's Droid phone? I think you've gotten a little carried away.

I said nothing about password reset emails. I come from an IT background. I can't even count the number of times I've sent temporary passwords over email to co-workers, customers, etc., including from my phone. If something can be sent via email, it will be, and when the numbers are in the millions...there's a lot of data that people consider private.

Re: Facebook e-mail mess: Address books altered, e-mail lost

#139

Post by angry-hacker » Sun, Jul 01, 2012, 6:31 AM UTC

sushantsharma wrote: post #76

angry-hacker wrote: post #22

Does anyone know if there is some kind of possibility to copy facebook contacts to my phone? I'm using Android+Facbook sync. Phone is rooted... I have at least 100 people who are facebook contacts and the ones I don't want to loose, but I'm not even able to copy paste their number not to mention copying them to phone/sim card... I know facebook doesn't want you to do it, but there has to be a way....

I just uninstalled facebook from my android phone. The facebook contacts and their information is still being shown in my phone contacts list. I am not sure if it will be deleted in future (during some sync operation). If that happens, I may install it back again. In the latter scenario, merging the contacts however will be a pain.

I tried the same and contacts disappeared.

Re: Facebook e-mail mess: Address books altered, e-mail lost

#140

Post by augustl » Sun, Jul 01, 2012, 6:34 AM UTC

SwellJoe wrote: post #138

tedunangst wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

passwords for other sites Wait, seriously? People are using websites where the password reset emails are being sent from somebody's Droid phone? I think you've gotten a little carried away.

I said nothing about password reset emails. I come from an IT background. I can't even count the number of times I've sent temporary passwords over email to co-workers, customers, etc., including from my phone. If something can be sent via email, it will be, and when the numbers are in the millions...there's a lot of data that people consider private.

Makes me wish asymmetric crypto was used more often :) "Hey, send me your public key and I'll encrypt and e-mail you the password."