Earlier quoted context omitted.
"There are great places to discuss AI safety out there" Like where?
Tell me where you’ve looked, and I will comment and reply.
Wow how secretive, very cool, I wanna be part of your secret club
Machines of loving grace: How AI could transform the world for the better
121–130 of 132 posts
Re: Machines of loving grace: How AI could transform the world for the better
#122Earlier quoted context omitted.
There are great places to discuss AI safety out there, but every time they get mentioned on Hacker News they are subject to sneering middlebrow dismissals. That's sort of the OP's point: this is not a great place to discuss or even meta-discuss the subject.
"There are great places to discuss AI safety out there" Like where?
I’m guessing he’s probably talking about LessWrong, which nowadays also hosts a ton of serious safety research (and is often dismissed offhandedly because of its reputation as an insular internet community).
Re: Machines of loving grace: How AI could transform the world for the better
#123Are Americans really so scared of Marx to admit that AI fundamentally proves his point? Dario here says "yeah likely the economic system won't work anymore" but he doesn't dare say what comes next: It's obvious some kind of socialist system is inevitable, at least for basic goods and housing. How can you deny that to a person in a post-AGI world where almost no one can produce economic value that beats the ever cheap…
I don't think Marx wrote much about AI and what he did write about didn't lead to much happiness when people tried to implement it. You can see that computers doing the work will lead to a different society without bringing Marx into it.
One of the Marx's points, afaik, is that industrial and post industrial capitalism is always aiming to reduce the cost of labor through technology. Communism would occur when such a diminutive amount of people could produce most of value that communism was the only solution (the actual mechanism is more complicated, I think, but I think the simplification is helpful). Sound familiar?
Re: Machines of loving grace: How AI could transform the world for the better
#124Earlier quoted context omitted.
"There are great places to discuss AI safety out there" Like where?
I’m guessing he’s probably talking about LessWrong, which nowadays also hosts a ton of serious safety research (and is often dismissed offhandedly because of its reputation as an insular internet community).
Yes, LessWrong and the Alignment Forum have a lot of excellent writing and a great community. It may not be to everyone's taste, however.
For people that have demonstrated various levels of commitment, such as post-graduate study and/or continuing education, there are various forums available.
I'm also interested to see what other people have found.
Re: Machines of loving grace: How AI could transform the world for the better
#125Earlier quoted context omitted.
Tell me where you’ve looked, and I will comment and reply.
Wow how secretive, very cool, I wanna be part of your secret club
I flagged the comment above because I think it doesn't belong here on Hacker News based on our guidelines. They help us understand our shared norms here.
https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html
> Be kind. Don't be snarky. Converse curiously; don't cross-examine. Edit out swipes.
At the same time, when I see this kind of sarcasm, I also wonder: where is the sarcasm coming from? How can we make this discussion productive?
If you start with the resources I suggested, I think you will find useful material.
Re: Machines of loving grace: How AI could transform the world for the better
#126The linked article is worth reading. Apologies for sounding so dismissive, but after putting in a lot of study myself, I want to warn people here: HN is not a great place for discussing AI safety. As of this writing, I’ve found minimal value in the comments here. A curious and truth-seeking reader should find better forums and sources. I recommend seeking out a structured introduction from experts. One could do worse…
The examples you mentioned: youtube, and a textbook; are not places to discuss, they are assymmetrical ways to consume information, with little input from the reader's part. Have you ever had a meaningful discussion in youtube comments?
I did not claim that they are forums (useful or otherwise) for discussion. They are good starting sources of information.
Re: Machines of loving grace: How AI could transform the world for the better
#127Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don't think Marx wrote much about AI and what he did write about didn't lead to much happiness when people tried to implement it. You can see that computers doing the work will lead to a different society without bringing Marx into it.
One of the Marx's points, afaik, is that industrial and post industrial capitalism is always aiming to reduce the cost of labor through technology. Communism would occur when such a diminutive amount of people could produce most of value that communism was the only solution (the actual mechanism is more complicated, I think, but I think the simplification is helpful). Sound familiar?
A bit although I'm not sure it pans out that way in practice. When tech allows humans to produce enough to eat with 1% of the population rather than 70% the others the figure they need cars/SUVs which didn't exist before and now manufacturing is mostly outsourced people become social media consultants that didn't exist before and so on.
Marx always lent towards let's divide people into two groups called workers and exploiters the group 1 can overthrow/kill 2 and install some ghastly dictatorship, which seems an iffy way to go to me.
Re: Machines of loving grace: How AI could transform the world for the better
#128One of the sad things about tech is that nobody really looks at history. The same kinds of essays were written about trains, planes and nuclear power. Before lindbergh went off the deepend, he was convinced that "airmen" were gentlemen and could sort out the world's ills. The essay contains a lot of coulds, but doesn't touch on the base problem: human nature. AI will be used to make things cheaper. That is, lots of j…
> One of the sad things about tech is that nobody really looks at history.
If this were phrased as "Many proponents of technology pay little attention to societal impacts" then I would agree.
The quote above is not true in this sense: there are many technology-aware people that study history. You may already have your favorites. Off the top of my head, I recommend Brian Christian and Nick Bostrom.
Re: Machines of loving grace: How AI could transform the world for the better
#129Earlier quoted context omitted.
One of the Marx's points, afaik, is that industrial and post industrial capitalism is always aiming to reduce the cost of labor through technology. Communism would occur when such a diminutive amount of people could produce most of value that communism was the only solution (the actual mechanism is more complicated, I think, but I think the simplification is helpful). Sound familiar?
A bit although I'm not sure it pans out that way in practice. When tech allows humans to produce enough to eat with 1% of the population rather than 70% the others the figure they need cars/SUVs which didn't exist before and now manufacturing is mostly outsourced people become social media consultants that didn't exist before and so on. Marx always lent towards let's divide people into two groups called workers and e…
Marx mostly didn't do that afaik. His followers did. But he didn't write about a dictatorship of the proletariat being violent, or killing lots of people.
Here's a good text I read recently about Marx vs the world's perception of him. https://www.newstatesman.com/long-reads/2023/02/why-marx-rel...
Re: Machines of loving grace: How AI could transform the world for the better
#130There are two possible end-states for AI once a threshold is crossed: The AIs take a look at the state of things and realize the KPIs will improve considerably if homo sapiens are removed from the picture. Cue "The Matrix" or "The Terminator" type future. OR: The AIs take a look and decide that keeping homo sapiens around makes things much more fun and interesting. They take over running things in a benevolent manner…
There's a third option which I call "The Pet Future": the AIs decide we make great pets. Look at how we deal with pets. We look after them, we love them and care for them. We feed them and have them share our lives. All in the knowledge that we are superior and that they are "simpler" than us.