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Christopher Columbus may have been Spanish and Jewish, documentary says

theguardian.com

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Re: Christopher Columbus may have been Spanish and Jewish, documentary says

#241

Post by aguaviva »

andai wrote: post #224
pvaldes wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is not such thing as "Jewish" DNA. Is a culture and religion, but not a fully different race. Some genes could be in the past more represented, but it was just "Mediterranean dotation". A mix of European, African and Asian. Today is much more mixed fortunately.

If you can't prove family connection with paperwork, you can emigrate to Israel by means of DNA test which proves to the government that you are Jewish. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5034383/ Couldn't find a page on the government website, but I remember reading about it there in the not too distant past.

That doesn't seem to be quite how it works; apparently the DNA test by itself is not sufficient, and one does need some form of paperwork. Per an explanation by a private law office:

  A DNA test can be used to obtain Israeli citizenship, but this is reserved to prove that a person is the child of an Israeli citizen.  According to Israeli law, if a child is born to an Israeli mother or father abroad, they can be granted Israeli citizenship.  The DNA test is used to authorize this, proving this familial link.  We discuss more about obtaining a paternity test in Israel in another article.

  In some very rare cases, a DNA test can be used to prove their relation to a Jewish parent, sibling or grandparent, even though the applicant doesn’t have documents proving this relationship, but said person has to have documents verifying that they are Jewish.
https://lawoffice.org.il/en/israeli-citizenship-dna-test/

Re: Christopher Columbus may have been Spanish and Jewish, documentary says

#242

Post by throwpoaster »

eo3x0 wrote: post #239
throwpoaster wrote: post #238

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's "Graun" -- wikipedia says a composer. What's the connection? I like the sound of the word.

It’s a nickname of the Guardian https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Graun

TIL

Re: Christopher Columbus may have been Spanish and Jewish, documentary says

#243

Post by dumbo-octopus »

lazide wrote: post #231
dumbo-octopus wrote: post #221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh and accepting Him as your Lord, not savior. Lord is the predicate, Savior is the consequence.

Do you have his number? Everyone I call tries to tell me I’m crazy in Spanish.

Fortunately, He took the time to document His work prior to leaving the company.

Re: Christopher Columbus may have been Spanish and Jewish, documentary says

#244

Post by corpMaverick »

juunpp wrote: post #107
kajecounterhack wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not to mention that he was hugely genocidal and enslaved the Tainos; who really wants to lay claim to that.

I don't know that Columbus was genocidal. He was a slaver, rapist, murderer, gold digger and all-round motherfucker for sure, so much so that the Spanish monarchy sent an envoy to arrest him, bring him back to Spain to be tried, and threw him in jail I think for a couple years. Aside from gold and spices sent from him back to the Spanish monarchs after his first arrival, he also sent back slaves and the queen was, pr…

Cortez only had about 500 soldiers. He didn't even had the permission of the Spanish crown, it was a private enterprise. How did he conquered a city of warriors with a population of 300K ? The Aztecs were tyrants that had abused their neighboring states for decades. Cortez built alliances with Tlaxalans and other tribes. There were battles, a small pox epidemic and a lot of blood. But Cortez was overall a great diplomat that took all the cities under Aztec control one by one until only Tenochtitlan remained.

Re: Christopher Columbus may have been Spanish and Jewish, documentary says

#246

Post by wslh »

lazide wrote: post #208
wslh wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Converting to Judaism can be easier than many people assume, sometimes even simpler than earning a high school degree. It's important to note that Judaism is not a proselytizing religion, meaning it doesn't actively seek to convert others. Instead, conversion is a deeply personal choice, and those who pursue it are welcomed after a meaningful process. Judaism is actually one of the major world religions, though it's…

Islam requires reciting a short sentence with conviction.[ https://www.webpages.uidaho.edu/~msa/tour/ch3-6.htm ]. Christianity requires (depending on who you ask/sect) - believing in Christ as your savior, or baptism, or being confirmed. Generally not an arduous process. Hinduism, you believe in the Dharma, and as long as you aren’t angering people enough they kick you out, you are Hindu. Some would argue, as long as…

Religion is a very sensitive topic. Full stop.

Re: Christopher Columbus may have been Spanish and Jewish, documentary says

#247

Post by netdevnet »

dumah wrote: post #222
netdevnet wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is not true though unless you explicitly mean something different. American does not equate to European American. Most Americans come from Mexico, India and China. In that order. European countries are not even in the top 5. You are probably talking about something else but are unable to phrase it properly likely due to some internal assumptions. You are welcome to share those assumptions :)

Most Americans (62%) have European ancestry. You are listing the most frequent origins of immigrants to America as of 2024. I’m not sure how this is relevant to the prior discussion. https://www.census.gov/library/stories/2023/09/2020-census-d...

You are right. It will be interesting to see how it changes given the fast rising Asian American demographics in the coming decades as Asia becomes host to more powerhouses.

Regarding your confusion, ancestry is the whole point of this thread. This sub-discussion just focused on a specific part of the discussion :)

Re: Christopher Columbus may have been Spanish and Jewish, documentary says

#248

Post by amirhirsch »

HKH2 wrote: post #198
amirhirsch wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are not logic-ing correctly. The financiers were Jewish. Jews do not charge interest to other Jews; if Columbus were not Jewish they would have charged interest. This is written in Deuteronomy 23:20-21 as well as Leviticus and Exodus and also discussed by Maimonides

> Jews do not charge interest to other Jews Even now?

Yes. There are many Jewish lending organizations designed around the principle that loaning money to establish a new business is the highest form of charity (see Maimonides 8 levels of giving). For example, there is a 127-year-old organization based in San Francisco that offers loans up to $50,000. The expectation is once someone establishes themselves they will contribute back to the lending organization. The workaround to halachic rules of interest that is applied in Israeli banking is equity co-ownership where the lender is paid back for their ownership shares at an established interest rate; the term for this is called “heter iska.”

Re: Christopher Columbus may have been Spanish and Jewish, documentary says

#249

Post by slightwinder »

egberts wrote: post #57

Interesting that King Ferdinand and Queen Isabella issued the Alhambra Decree to kick the Jews out ot Spain shortly after Christopher Columbus, a Sephardic Jew, reached the Americas. This was even after the Jews heavily funded the Spaniard military in the conquest of Gibraltar. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alhambra_Decree

Your history seems wrong. The Alhambra Decree was issued on 31 March 1492. Columbus sealed his deal in April 1492, and started the first(!) expedition on 3 August 1492. And it seems he only reached the continent of America itself on his fourth expedition.
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