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On 17th century "cocaine"

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Re: On 17th century "cocaine"

#81

Post by School-Cotton »

nicoburns wrote: post #74
wafflemaker wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I see sense in articulating that cocaine use was different in 17th c. compared to now, I don't believe that you'd argue the same against someone saying that a person drinking beer is drinking alcohol, because beer has less alcohol than vodka.

To make this analogous, the words for "alcohol" and "vodka" would have to be the same. The OP is arguing that when people say "doing cocaine" they are generally referring to the high-strength powdered form, not the underlying chemical in general. And that if we interpret the sentence like that (which we should if that's how it's generally understood) then it is not true that people were doing cocaine in the 17th cent…

Random tangent: now I’m curious if there are any languages where the word for alcohol and vodka (or whatever is locally the most common spirit) is the same. Seems plausible that there would be.

Re: On 17th century "cocaine"

#82

Post by voidmain0001 »

I inherited a small hardcover handbook on the use of cocaine in medicine and the household. I don’t have it in front of me at the moment so I don’t remember the print date. I’m guessing late 1800 or early 1900. Ah. DDG to rescue, here is a version of it. https://www.thebookmerchantjenkins.com/product/coca-and-coca... Certainly a different perspective on it from today.

Re: On 17th century "cocaine"

#83

Post by pimeys »

sva_ wrote: post #71
herbst wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is also this one from Italy: https://it.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coca_Buton (Which is a actually buyable product that appearantly is one of the biggest, if not the biggest, coke leaf import company in europe. It's a lovely liqueur)

You can buy coca tea in headshops in Netherlands as well.

It actually works great replacing coffee as an after lunch drink.

Re: On 17th century "cocaine"

#84

Post by cannonpr »

The ban on cocaine is kind of annoying even in its pure form, it’s a very useful local anaesthetic with good tolerance, low side effects that few people are allergic to. I have often wished it was included in some of the more advanced first aid kits, or used more widely for minor operations.

Re: On 17th century "cocaine"

#85

Post by malfist »

cannonpr wrote: post #84

The ban on cocaine is kind of annoying even in its pure form, it’s a very useful local anaesthetic with good tolerance, low side effects that few people are allergic to. I have often wished it was included in some of the more advanced first aid kits, or used more widely for minor operations.

We have good local anesthetics that don't carry the same addiction risk. There's no reason to provide such a potent addictive drug at OTC.

Re: On 17th century "cocaine"

#86

Post by lqet »

voidmain0001 wrote: post #82

I inherited a small hardcover handbook on the use of cocaine in medicine and the household. I don’t have it in front of me at the moment so I don’t remember the print date. I’m guessing late 1800 or early 1900. Ah. DDG to rescue, here is a version of it. https://www.thebookmerchantjenkins.com/product/coca-and-coca... Certainly a different perspective on it from today.

Reading the complete Sherlock Holmes stories a few months ago, I also noticed how casually the frequent use of cocaine by Holmes is mentioned as a small vice, a recreational drug that is also "chemically clean", so nothing to worry about. Opium, on the other hand, is associated with disease, crime, and the criminal underworld.

Re: On 17th century "cocaine"

#87

Post by kasey_junk »

School-Cotton wrote: post #81
nicoburns wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To make this analogous, the words for "alcohol" and "vodka" would have to be the same. The OP is arguing that when people say "doing cocaine" they are generally referring to the high-strength powdered form, not the underlying chemical in general. And that if we interpret the sentence like that (which we should if that's how it's generally understood) then it is not true that people were doing cocaine in the 17th cent…

Random tangent: now I’m curious if there are any languages where the word for alcohol and vodka (or whatever is locally the most common spirit) is the same. Seems plausible that there would be.

Scottish?

Re: On 17th century "cocaine"

#88

Post by xnorswap »

Mtinie wrote: post #80
sinkasapa wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It definitely seems misleading to talk about coca leaf use as cocaine use, given the common expectation for what that means. People reading the newspaper probably don't know all these details, and it isn't spelled out. I can't imagine some guy in a club not feeling like he was robbed after paying for a powdery drug and then receiving a handful of leaves. I can't imagine an Andean woman sitting down for morning tea be…

https://pubchem.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/compound/Cocaine Does the molecule C17H21NO4 exist in both the raw, dried leaves of the coca plant, and a powdered, refined extract from the same plant?

https://nibblestew.blogspot.com/2020/04/your-statement-is-10...

Re: On 17th century "cocaine"

#89

Post by Eumenes »

LandR wrote: post #79
yard2010 wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Hiking in altitude is hands down the hardest thing I did in my life. On the first day I almost died of an altitude sickness. On the following days, climbing 5 meters up the mountain felt like climbing the whole mountain twice. After every 10 steps I had to stop for 30-60 seconds and catch my breath. I drank a lot of coca tea and couldn't feel anything different. Peru, especially cordillera negra/blanca is the most sp…

> Hiking in altitude is hands down the hardest thing I did in my life HOw much preparation did you do before hand ? I'm looking at a himalayan trip next year to around a 23k feet summit (over the course of 30 days or so). I'm taking a year to train for it, but I have no way to train for 'altitude', and as I understand it reaction to altitude doesn't correlate that much with overall fitness. You can apparently be supe…

If you can't train at altitude, I'd focus on distance/time in. Go on long runs, long hikes, long bike rides. Endurance. Elevation gain is good too. Try to at least mirror the conditions per mile in your training. Hill intervals are useful - walk up a big steep hill at a steady pace, and then walk back down; rinse/repeat. A solid cardiovascular base should prepare you just fine.

Re: On 17th century "cocaine"

#90

Post by Leonelf »

cannonpr wrote: post #84

The ban on cocaine is kind of annoying even in its pure form, it’s a very useful local anaesthetic with good tolerance, low side effects that few people are allergic to. I have often wished it was included in some of the more advanced first aid kits, or used more widely for minor operations.

"In the United States, cocaine is regulated as a Schedule II drug under the Controlled Substances Act, meaning that it has a high potential for abuse but has an accepted medical use. While rarely used medically today, its accepted uses are as a topical local anesthetic for the upper respiratory tract as well as to reduce bleeding in the mouth, throat and nasal cavities.", from Wikipedias cocaine page. I remember septoplasty surgery using topical cocaine for example.
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