XFCE 4.20 aims to bring preliminary Wayland support • Hacker News Board

Re: XFCE 4.20 aims to bring preliminary Wayland support

#201

Post by urlwolf » Tue, Oct 08, 2024, 10:30 AM UTC

consteval wrote: post #185

FloatArtifact wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If accessibility is a serious concern, Linux is probably not the OS for you. It's so far behind in accessibility compared to Windows it's not even funny. Linux is fine with X11 per my requirements above. The biggest problem is the fragmentation caused by Wayland. I cant develop software that targets any reasonable range of desktop environments much less, the features needed. If Wayland was left and X11 was right th…

> I cant develop software that targets any reasonable range of desktop environments I highly recommend Qt for this purpose. Gtk has been a hot mess for the past few years with Gtk4 and libadwaita shenanigans. However, Qt has continued to evolve incrementally without dropping any backwards functionality. It's incredibly full-featured and has amazing tooling. In addition to Qt Creator you also have the CLI tools for pa…

This is because GTK is C, not C++. It's much easier to write bindings from C

Re: XFCE 4.20 aims to bring preliminary Wayland support

#202

Post by sylware » Tue, Oct 08, 2024, 1:57 PM UTC

kelnos wrote: post #148

sylware wrote: post #135

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Until wlroots is statically linked into xfce compositor... you know, if we could avoid the mess of the bazillion of x11 libs all over again...

Not sure what you mean. Hopefully I'll be basing it on a released version of wlroots (or at least a non-released version that that will be released by the time I'm ready), which will be dynamically linked just like everything else. And even if it isn't, and it's statically linked, so what? RAM is cheap and plentiful in most places these days, and if you're really upset about it you can build it yourself with --disabl…

Because putting everything in shared libs is what made the mess of the bazillion of x11 libs, even though x11 is a IPC protocol.

If I am upset about something, it is wlroots does not manage properly its symbol namespaces with the C preprocessor, that to reduce to near 0 the possibility to have symbol collision while static linking.

The great thing is finally xfce is going to have its wayland compositor. And there, there is not negativity, only positivity, because the real core of wayland is orders of magnitude simpler than x11 core, and wayland is getting its way on mobile, which means with vulkan3d, dude, the future looks bright, not grim, cheer up.

Re: XFCE 4.20 aims to bring preliminary Wayland support

#203

Post by consteval » Tue, Oct 08, 2024, 2:42 PM UTC

urlwolf wrote: post #201

consteval wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I cant develop software that targets any reasonable range of desktop environments I highly recommend Qt for this purpose. Gtk has been a hot mess for the past few years with Gtk4 and libadwaita shenanigans. However, Qt has continued to evolve incrementally without dropping any backwards functionality. It's incredibly full-featured and has amazing tooling. In addition to Qt Creator you also have the CLI tools for pa…

This is because GTK is C, not C++. It's much easier to write bindings from C

Yes, I think the design of GTK and GObject worked out really well in the long run. On the surface it seems stupid to use C and then just "bolt on" a C++-like system on top. Why not just use C++? But clearly it's worked out.

Unfortunately, GTK has it's own set of drawbacks.

Re: XFCE 4.20 aims to bring preliminary Wayland support

#204

Post by consteval » Tue, Oct 08, 2024, 2:45 PM UTC

FloatArtifact wrote: post #199

consteval wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I cant develop software that targets any reasonable range of desktop environments I highly recommend Qt for this purpose. Gtk has been a hot mess for the past few years with Gtk4 and libadwaita shenanigans. However, Qt has continued to evolve incrementally without dropping any backwards functionality. It's incredibly full-featured and has amazing tooling. In addition to Qt Creator you also have the CLI tools for pa…

> > I cant develop software that targets any reasonable range of desktop environments > > I highly recommend Qt for this purpose. I really appreciate your comment. QT is a great framework doing a lot of heavy lifting. However, the accessibility software I help maintain needs the ability to know what windows are in the foreground, all applications running and emulating key/text/mouse input in any of those running appl…

If you target just one Wayland compositor, I think this is possible. I mean, each Wayland compositor is basically a display server. The trouble is the Wayland protocol itself doesn't necessarily provide all the tools for this (it does provide some, particularly in conjunction with systems like pipewire and portals).

But, for example, I think kwin can definitely do this.