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Nobel Prize in Physics awarded to John Hopfield and Geoffrey Hinton [pdf]

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Re: Nobel Prize in Physics awarded to John Hopfield and Geoffrey Hinton [pdf]

#121

Post by drpossum »

lr1970 wrote: post #114
elashri wrote: post #66

As a physicist, my reaction to this is how bizarre is that. Maybe he deserves a nobel prize but in physics? Also arguing that NN is used in physics so we can argue nobel prize is okay is like asking for Stephan Wolfram to be awarded Nobel prize for Mathematica which is much more used in physics as a tool. And he is a physicist and had contributions to the field of numerical relativity (The reason he created Mathemati…

By this definition Claude Shannon (the father of Information Theory) clearly deserves a Nobel in Physics. The central concept in Information Theory is Entropy which is defined literally the same way as in Physics. And Shannon's Information Theory clearly revolutionized our life (tele-communications) much more than Hopfield network or Hinton's Boltzmann machine.

Fun historical fact: Claude Shannon did win the Noble prize

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfred_Noble_Prize#Recipients

Re: Nobel Prize in Physics awarded to John Hopfield and Geoffrey Hinton [pdf]

#122

Post by nabla9 »

okintheory wrote: post #109
nabla9 wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Boltzmann machines and associative memories originate in physics.

But, the starting point of Neural Networks in the ML/AI sense, is cybernetics + Rosenblatt's perceptron, research done mathematicians (who became early computer scientists)

This is price in physics. Not price in Neural Networks. Starting point of Hopfield's and Hintons work in recurrent networks was physics analogy.

Neural networks and physical systems with emergent collective computational abilities https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC346238/

Re: Nobel Prize in Physics awarded to John Hopfield and Geoffrey Hinton [pdf]

#123

Post by dosshell »

kelahcim wrote: post #71
aquafox wrote: post #6

"This year’s laureates used tools from physics to construct methods that helped lay the foundation for today’s powerful machine learning." Does this mean if I'd use a deep understanding of birds to design way more aerodynamic airplanes, I could get the Nobel prize in physiology/medicine? Don't get me wrong, their work is probably prize worthy, but shouldn't the Nobel prize in physics be awarded for discoveries in the…

Kahneman was awarded Nobel prize in economic sciences even though his work was, in fact, all about psychology.

Note that: There are no economic science Nobel prize.

Only one similar named price in the name and memory of Alfred Nobel, which some how, is allowed to be part of the Nobel prize celebration.

I guess my opinion is in minority, but i don't like that another prize hijacks the Nobel prize.

Re: Nobel Prize in Physics awarded to John Hopfield and Geoffrey Hinton [pdf]

#124

Post by [deleted] »

drpossum wrote: post #121
lr1970 wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By this definition Claude Shannon (the father of Information Theory) clearly deserves a Nobel in Physics. The central concept in Information Theory is Entropy which is defined literally the same way as in Physics. And Shannon's Information Theory clearly revolutionized our life (tele-communications) much more than Hopfield network or Hinton's Boltzmann machine.

Fun historical fact: Claude Shannon did win the Noble prize https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfred_Noble_Prize#Recipients

[deleted]

Re: Nobel Prize in Physics awarded to John Hopfield and Geoffrey Hinton [pdf]

#125

Post by meindnoch »

amelius wrote: post #78
elashri wrote: post #66

As a physicist, my reaction to this is how bizarre is that. Maybe he deserves a nobel prize but in physics? Also arguing that NN is used in physics so we can argue nobel prize is okay is like asking for Stephan Wolfram to be awarded Nobel prize for Mathematica which is much more used in physics as a tool. And he is a physicist and had contributions to the field of numerical relativity (The reason he created Mathemati…

It feels a bit like the field of physics claiming the invention of AI, where we all know that mathematics and/or CS deserve the honor.

>where we all know that mathematics and/or CS deserve the honor

Or semiconductor manufacturers.

All the math and CS needed for AI can fit on a napkin, and had been known for 200+ years. It's the extreme scaling enabled by semiconductor science that really makes the difference.

Re: Nobel Prize in Physics awarded to John Hopfield and Geoffrey Hinton [pdf]

#126

Post by seydor »

aquafox wrote: post #6

"This year’s laureates used tools from physics to construct methods that helped lay the foundation for today’s powerful machine learning." Does this mean if I'd use a deep understanding of birds to design way more aerodynamic airplanes, I could get the Nobel prize in physiology/medicine? Don't get me wrong, their work is probably prize worthy, but shouldn't the Nobel prize in physics be awarded for discoveries in the…

I studied physics in the 90s and we had an NNs course, where most of the models were inspired by physics (MLPs was just one). NNs have been used since decades for identifying e.g. the trajectories of particles at CERN. I remember Hinton's work with Sejnowski (who probably should also be awarded). I was actually surprised to find out that Hinton was not a physicist by training

Obviously physicists take great interest in models of the brain or models of intelligence. All of physics is modeling , after all

Re: Nobel Prize in Physics awarded to John Hopfield and Geoffrey Hinton [pdf]

#127

Post by kenjackson »

programjames wrote: post #42

This is embarrassing. I would say Hopfield networks aren't even very revolutionary in neuroscience, but they're so old I can't tell. In terms of AI... they've been irrelevant for thirty years. I guess you could argue a transformer is a generalized Hopfield network, but of course that's a post-hoc understanding. None of this has anything to do with physics. So what if an energy function lets you approximate the number…

Curious, would Peter Shor qualify? I struggle if his work is really just CS or enough physics to be in the discussion.

Re: Nobel Prize in Physics awarded to John Hopfield and Geoffrey Hinton [pdf]

#128

Post by elashri »

drpossum wrote: post #121
lr1970 wrote: post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

By this definition Claude Shannon (the father of Information Theory) clearly deserves a Nobel in Physics. The central concept in Information Theory is Entropy which is defined literally the same way as in Physics. And Shannon's Information Theory clearly revolutionized our life (tele-communications) much more than Hopfield network or Hinton's Boltzmann machine.

Fun historical fact: Claude Shannon did win the Noble prize https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfred_Noble_Prize#Recipients

That's different local prize by the American society of civil engineers.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alfred_Noble_Prize

Re: Nobel Prize in Physics awarded to John Hopfield and Geoffrey Hinton [pdf]

#129

Post by vasco »

Arkhaine_kupo wrote: post #82
Urahandystar wrote: post #25

[flagged]

This is such a tired reply. The peace prize is not part of the same group as the other awards, and a significant difference in the peace award is that intent is awarded not results. The dude who invented the MAD doctrine did not get the award despite nuke deterrance doctrice being related to the least amount of wars in any century since WW2. But his platform of deescalation and his plans for american foregin diplomac…

The road to hell is paved with good intentions. The award shouldn't have been given for intentions, before he even did anything. We should not reward promises, but action. Even a long term member of the committee expressed regret in them giving it to Obama.
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