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Google won't be mandating a strict return-to-office plan

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Re: Google won't be mandating a strict return-to-office plan

#51

Post by cush »

I know multiple people who worked at Amazon (I say worked because they've recently quit) who would log two of their three weekly badges by going in the office at 11:59pm, and again at 12:01 am. Their team, managers, and collaborators never actually expected them at their desks. It was all to appease this mandate.

It's not surprising that Amazon has moved to 5 days a week despite so many people gaming the system and not actually caring about being in person. There's likely some algorithm driving this entire movement that doesn't take into account any of the real nuance that team dynamics requires, let alone taking into account that there are tangible benefits to remote work.

Re: Google won't be mandating a strict return-to-office plan

#53

Post by fhdsgbbcaA »

Spooky23 wrote: post #44
xyst wrote: post #12

They say this now. But in 12 months (or the next layoff period), they will move from hybrid to full RTO. Still a shitty move to mandate RTO. Most people (IT folks) have spoke with do this routine: 0) daily routine to prepare for day 1) 1 hr commute to shitty office 2) login to computer, do calls with cross regional (and international) teams over Zoom/Teams/Webex or whatever conferencing system 3) teleconferencing wit…

There’s a ton of fraud in this space. You need at least hybrid to keep that at bay. At a previous place, we chose hybrid RTO over intrusive surveillance. My opinion shifted from being a full remote advocate after I caught a half dozen folks with various schemes and scams. The straw that broke the camels back was a guy who lied about where he was living. He was going through a divorce and the ex-wife ratted him out to…

Define “fraud”? If you get your work done in two hours and can’t progress until a teammate does their end, is it better or worse if you are scrolling HN in an office or at home?

I run my own company, I do not give a single fuck how, where, or when people get their job done. I only care they deliver.

Likewise, people who need to be watched over are not the employees I want in the first place. I’m not running a daycare for children. Adults can make their own decisions, if you need me over your shoulder to deliver you aren’t useful to me to start with.

Re: Google won't be mandating a strict return-to-office plan

#54

Post by baq »

mrangle wrote: post #38

There's going to be a significant exodus of Amazon employees once the mandate kicks in fully. A percentage aren't able to come into the office every day, due to unrealistic commute logistics. Google making this headline sets them up to catch a lot of talent at once, to the point that I suspect this may be part of the policy's intent.

it remains to be seen if it will be a net positive for amazon, but people quitting is expected and the primary reason they implemented RTO. it's right there in the public announcement.

Re: Google won't be mandating a strict return-to-office plan

#55

Post by Terr_ »

mushufasa wrote: post #13
blackeyeblitzar wrote: post #5

I applaud Microsoft and Google for not going with a full RTO. But hybrid work still requires you to live near an office. True remote work enables an economy that is spread out, resilient, and lets people live the way they want. We have this capability so why not do it?

> We have this capability so why not do it? sortof yes, sortof no. Aside from all the conversation about work culture, state taxes are a big barrier to fully remote work. States hate losing tax revenue. Notoriously, it is easier to register to do business in a state than to unregister. This is even harder internationally. For large organizations, remote can be the difference between one state's paperwork + regs + tax…

> state taxes are a big barrier to fully remote work

What percentage of remote-workers are in a different tax-jurisdiction? Especially post-COVID I expected that the majority of remote-work involved people already in the same US state, merely with a nontrivial commute.

Re: Google won't be mandating a strict return-to-office plan

#56

Post by skybrian »

xyst wrote: post #12

They say this now. But in 12 months (or the next layoff period), they will move from hybrid to full RTO. Still a shitty move to mandate RTO. Most people (IT folks) have spoke with do this routine: 0) daily routine to prepare for day 1) 1 hr commute to shitty office 2) login to computer, do calls with cross regional (and international) teams over Zoom/Teams/Webex or whatever conferencing system 3) teleconferencing wit…

Google had flex time for all the time I worked there, for a dozen years, well before the pandemic. I don't see any particular reason it wouldn't work for them now?

Re: Google won't be mandating a strict return-to-office plan

#57

Post by josephcsible »

I wish this commitment had some kind of actual teeth, maybe something like adding "if we ever require RTO for you to keep your job, and you don't want to, we'll give you 2 years' severance with full benefits" to every remote employee's employment contract.

Re: Google won't be mandating a strict return-to-office plan

#58

Post by barsonme »

ryandrake wrote: post #45
worstspotgain wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the Bay Area, 1-hour commutes are generally for older and apartment people. Younger family people are in the 2+ range.

When I lived in the Bay Area, my commute was ~2.5 hours each way. I would have killed for a 1 hour commute.

That’s insane. 13 hours of work + commute. After 7 hours of sleep you only have 4 hours left in your day for literally everything else.

Re: Google won't be mandating a strict return-to-office plan

#59

Post by time0ut »

ENGNR wrote: post #32
skzv wrote: post #18

I go to the office almost everyday by choice. Free food, snacks, and coffee, gym, and medical clinics on campus. And it's just nice to get dressed and leave the house. But it's really nice to have the flexibility to WFH when I need to, especially just mornings to skip traffic.

Same! Tech job, my co-founder and I are only a 5 minute drive or bike ride from the office. It’s nice to get dressed and have that separation from home. I feel like the commute is what people are actually feeling the worst, because it’s unpaid time that they just straight up lose. Being close to the office resolves it for us.

I don't have the discipline to stop working when I work from home. Being able to go into the office every day is a nice perk for me to help structure my day. If it was a longer drive, I'd probably feel differently.
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