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Dance training superior to physical exercise in inducing brain plasticity (2018)

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Re: Dance training superior to physical exercise in inducing brain plasticity (2018)

#51

Post by westurner »

bogtog wrote: post #19

I do MRI work, and my gut is that none of the claims about dance vs. exercise would replicate. The behavioral data suggests that activity of some type will improve cognitive function (main effects of time). Such beneficial effects of activity on the brain have been shown before, and this is generally accepted. However, the authors' behavioral data doesn't show any difference between the dance vs. exercise groups. Thi…

Cardiovascular exercise correlates with subsequent synthesis of endocannabinoids, which affect hippocampal neurogeneration and probably thereby neuroplasticity.

From "Environment shapes emotional cognitive abilities more than genes" (2024) https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40105068#40107602 :

> hippocampal plasticity and hippocampal neurogenesis also appear to be affected by dancing and omega-3,6 (which are transformed into endocannabinoids by the body): https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15109698

Also, isn't there selection bias to observational dance studies? If not in good general health, is a person likely to pursue regular dancing? Though, dance lifts mood and gets the cardiovascular system going.

Dance involves spatial sense and proprioception and probably all of the senses.

Re: Dance training superior to physical exercise in inducing brain plasticity (2018)

#52

Post by marginalia_nu »

changing1999 wrote: post #22
HPsquared wrote: post #4

Balance training (standing on a ball type thing) also is supposed to help ADHD.

This (intuitively) makes sense, since standing on a ball requires full focus, can't really get distracted.

Does it though? Balancing doesn't seem like an active cognitive process, like I don't have to think about not falling over to stay upright on a bicycle. All the little shifts of body weight needed to not tip over seem to be done automatically.

Re: Dance training superior to physical exercise in inducing brain plasticity (2018)

#53

Post by nonrandomstring »

fransje26 wrote: post #44
anonzzzies wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, added styles there. Kata's can be quite dance-y depending on the style. Also, to be contrary old dude into martial arts all his life, I don't really consider many head bashing 'styles' now to be 'arts'. Martial, sure.

> Also, to be contrary old dude into martial arts all his life, I don't really consider many head bashing 'styles' now to be 'arts'. Which ones would you consider to be "arts", and worth getting into? I was recently thinking that I would like to get back into martial arts, but having done taekwondo in the past, I'm absolutely not interested in going back to any form of bashing impact..

Chen style tai-chi.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chen-style_tai_chi

Re: Dance training superior to physical exercise in inducing brain plasticity (2018)

#54

Post by BaculumMeumEst »

changing1999 wrote: post #15

I would like to see a comparison with other types of physical exercise that contain an element of continuous learning. Wrestling, BJJ, even boxercise, crossfit and such. Since the argument seems to be specifically about learning new routines and how that impacts neuroplasticity, dance vs other more cognitively challenging workouts would be an interesting comparison.

I think if your exercise involves you regularly getting choked out you probably shouldn’t be expecting neurological benefits

Re: Dance training superior to physical exercise in inducing brain plasticity (2018)

#55

Post by anonzzzies »

fransje26 wrote: post #44
anonzzzies wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, added styles there. Kata's can be quite dance-y depending on the style. Also, to be contrary old dude into martial arts all his life, I don't really consider many head bashing 'styles' now to be 'arts'. Martial, sure.

> Also, to be contrary old dude into martial arts all his life, I don't really consider many head bashing 'styles' now to be 'arts'. Which ones would you consider to be "arts", and worth getting into? I was recently thinking that I would like to get back into martial arts, but having done taekwondo in the past, I'm absolutely not interested in going back to any form of bashing impact..

I will try to do Aikido until I die. I started in the 80s with Kyokushin and I trained with top trainers; when I was young they wanted to move me to thai or kick boxing as I would, like numerous dutch guys did of the same school, kick the fuck out of the competition. Never had that interest. I like the movements and indeed the art behind it. Someone in this thread said boxing is like ballroom dancing; I really don't see that. Maybe it can be; but if you want to win, it's not dancing and the aspect of wanting 'to win' makes it not at all like dancing (or maybe I don't know this dance).

Anyway; as a kid I did Judo and after that Kyokushinkai and Jiujitsu 3-4 hours a day for many years.

I am 50 now and I can do things many 50 year olds cannot do, but the joy for me is that I feel like when I go to aikido class 3 times a week, it is an art and it doesn't feel like I have to ever stop doing it as I don't need (but can I guess) to bash in faces in a rings.

Re: Dance training superior to physical exercise in inducing brain plasticity (2018)

#56

Post by tgv »

One should really not draw conclusions based on this.

* It's a (small) group of 63-80 year olds.

* There's no evidence for increased neuro-plasticity. How could there be? There's only an dubious effect on BDNF plasma and "BDNF may be a possible mediating factor of adult neuroplasticity".

* The groups start out with a difference, but by misapplying statistics, they conclude there's no difference.

Re: Dance training superior to physical exercise in inducing brain plasticity (2018)

#57

Post by svilen_dobrev »

unshavedyak wrote: post #6
HPsquared wrote: post #4

Balance training (standing on a ball type thing) also is supposed to help ADHD.

Can you link anything on the subject? Sounds like a simple device you could own at home and spend 10m a day on balancing.

on the opposite end of simple-or-cheap, e-foiling Does train your balance. esp. in windy "cabbage-salad" waves with medusas and rubbish floating around :/

Re: Dance training superior to physical exercise in inducing brain plasticity (2018)

#58

Post by laristine »

For a research article, modifiers may be more important in imposing constraints and necessary insights in cause and effect. The full title of this article is "Dance training is superior to repetitive physical exercise in inducing brain plasticity in the elderly".

While the current title on HN is "Dance training superior to physical exercise in inducing brain plasticity".

Re: Dance training superior to physical exercise in inducing brain plasticity (2018)

#59

Post by agumonkey »

bogtog wrote: post #19

I do MRI work, and my gut is that none of the claims about dance vs. exercise would replicate. The behavioral data suggests that activity of some type will improve cognitive function (main effects of time). Such beneficial effects of activity on the brain have been shown before, and this is generally accepted. However, the authors' behavioral data doesn't show any difference between the dance vs. exercise groups. Thi…

My random opinion is that dance or dance like activities are a sweet spot between low intensity and high intensity exercise that involves a lot more balance, coordination and fluidity than most physical activities promoted for health overall (they're either too simple or too hard), these traits are (I believe) very important to your brain. Add the social aspect as an important bonus.
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