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A $1k Wheelchair

newmobility.com

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Re: A $1k Wheelchair

#281

Post by lynx23 »

mistercheph wrote: post #275
lynx23 wrote: post #258

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Assistive technology costs are high because consumers barely have an alternative. I am blind. In Europe, a 40-cell braille display starts a 6k. 6k, just for a monitor which displays 40 characters . Prices are largely unchanged since 20 years. Technological advancements are irrelevant. Resellers will squeeze the cow, thats plain capitalism man.

Just from googling -- an orbit reader 40-cell appears to cost $1,700 USD, is there a reason this doesn't actually solve the same problem as the 6,000 euro display, or are these not available in your market for that cost? Sorry if my question is off the mark, I don't know a lot about this and your comment piqued my curiosity.

Orbit reader is the most low-quality device you can find on the market. This is like suggesting a bicycle to someone complaining about car prices.

Re: A $1k Wheelchair

#282

Post by imhoguy »

TrainedMonkey wrote: post #31
Havoc wrote: post #23

For context - he has a ~9m sub youtube channel on phones that must be banking it. This is a side project that appears to be grown out of frustration of disabled wife & seeing the shitshow that wheelchair market is. Seems 10/10 wholesome to have this disrupted by someone that cares

> This is a side project that appears to be grown out of frustration of disabled wife & seeing the shitshow that wheelchair market is While it is absolutely true that he cares, I think you are selling his long term plans short. The primary growth factor for the channel was reviewing phones with the repairability / endurance focus, but somewhat recently he expanded to topics such as plugging abandoned oil wells which…

> abandoned oil wells which are leaking methane

What? That still happens with so much CO2 and climate change outrage and people literally gluing themselves to roads as protest?

Ok, did more research: "In 2021, fugitive U.S. methane emissions from abandoned wells were 295 kilotons—equivalent to 8.2million metric tons (MMT) of CO2 with a 95% confidence interval of 1.4 to 25.1 MMT, the largest uncertainty range among the nation’s largest sources of methane (US EPA 2023)." https://www.doi.gov/sites/doi.gov/files/orphaned-wells-metha...

Re: A $1k Wheelchair

#283

Post by TaylorAlexander »

bradley13 wrote: post #278
fotta wrote: post #16

Custom fit lightweight wheelchairs are expensive. My Ti-Lite (one of the most popular lightweight chair brands) Aero Z starts at $3k and goes up quickly with wheels and backrest and casters and various other options that I need for sitting 16 hours a day without creating more problems. Insurance covers this for me every 5 years, but of course that's not a luxury every one has. Most plans don't cover DME 100%. What Za…

A manual wheelchair is less complex than a bicycle, and I can get a decent bicycle for a few hundred bucks. The fact that basic wheelchairs are crazy expensive has little to do with the chairs and a lot to do with insane bureaucracy.

Well, bicycles have more demand and volume (presumably), so that would play in to it. But yes, bicycles are a good point of reference.

Re: A $1k Wheelchair

#284

Post by srockets »

urban_winter wrote: post #259
devjab wrote: post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s not that small of a market if you consider how many wheelchairs the European public sector buys. Take your average Danish hospital and they’ll have at least 10 wheelchairs placed at every major entrance. They’re basically like shopping carts in a lot of public healthcare places. These are semi-regularity replaced because of wear and tear. If you could supply them with a cheap, solid be easily repairable version…

$1000 is not cheap for an off the shelf wheelchair such as hospitals make available for patients (in the UK, at least). That was my first thought on reading the article - "$1000 for a wheelchair, really?" - and a quick Google shows that you can buy what looks like reasonable quality wheelchairs for less than that. But the ones on the article are custom-made for each buyer, which is clearly a vastly more expensive opt…

No, you can't buy a reasonable quality wheelchair for less. You can buy what a person who doesn't need a wheelchair consider reasonable. If you had to use those cheap chairs for 16 hours a day, and pushing yourself even just for a mile of well paved roads, not even uphill, you would never consider those reasonable.

Re: A $1k Wheelchair

#285

Post by PeterStuer »

bradley13 wrote: post #278
fotta wrote: post #16

Custom fit lightweight wheelchairs are expensive. My Ti-Lite (one of the most popular lightweight chair brands) Aero Z starts at $3k and goes up quickly with wheels and backrest and casters and various other options that I need for sitting 16 hours a day without creating more problems. Insurance covers this for me every 5 years, but of course that's not a luxury every one has. Most plans don't cover DME 100%. What Za…

A manual wheelchair is less complex than a bicycle, and I can get a decent bicycle for a few hundred bucks. The fact that basic wheelchairs are crazy expensive has little to do with the chairs and a lot to do with insane bureaucracy.

Third party payment markets tend to have prices spin out of control. Usually the end user demand is fairly inelastic, and the third party is not driven by cost efficiencies in the negotiation. Getting into those markets as a new supplier is very hard as typically a select few incumbents have longstanding relations/deals with the third party.

Re: A $1k Wheelchair

#286

Post by s4i »

jillesvangurp wrote: post #242

I just did a search for wheelchairs on the German version of Amazon. I'm not in the market but I was just curious. https://www.amazon.de/-/en/gp/bestsellers/drugstore/28602980... There are lots of models with very reasonable prices and features; mostly well below 1000 euros. Including a few electric ones. Manual ones seem to be generally well below 500 euros. At 1000 euros we're talking some seriously tricked out mod…

If you’re not in the market, I find it ironic you think you can assess if that $999 electric chair or those sub-$500 manual chairs are good deals. From the other comments here it seems like they aren’t.

Re: A $1k Wheelchair

#287

Post by volfonibros »

patmcc wrote: post #181

This looks like a very cool project and I'm happy to see it. But please, to the author: give us some real price comparisons! I don't know how much a wheelchair costs. After reading this article, I still don't. Just be crystal clear and say "a simple manual wheelchair, approved by insurance, is often $4k, with $1k paid out of pocket" or whatever.

From their front page : "For more than three decades, New Mobility has published groundbreaking content for active wheelchair users."

Fair from them to assume the (average) reader is familiar with the subject.

Re: A $1k Wheelchair

#288

Post by jajko »

bradley13 wrote: post #278
fotta wrote: post #16

Custom fit lightweight wheelchairs are expensive. My Ti-Lite (one of the most popular lightweight chair brands) Aero Z starts at $3k and goes up quickly with wheels and backrest and casters and various other options that I need for sitting 16 hours a day without creating more problems. Insurance covers this for me every 5 years, but of course that's not a luxury every one has. Most plans don't cover DME 100%. What Za…

A manual wheelchair is less complex than a bicycle, and I can get a decent bicycle for a few hundred bucks. The fact that basic wheelchairs are crazy expensive has little to do with the chairs and a lot to do with insane bureaucracy.

Economies of scale and lack of competition.

When you have all the components for a cheap bike made in 100s of thousands by ie Shimano, the price goes down dramatically. Wheelchairs? Unless there is 1 dominant manufacturer its not going to happen to smaller shops, and monopoly has its own issues.

When you have regulatory tape which require some steep price hikes to cover some specific aspect (which may not be that important), combined with above you get what you get.

I was recently wheelchair-bound for a month due to my recent paragliding accident (crutches now for at least 1 month more, overall an interesting experience of various limits lying everywhere you don't even realize until you are there), and can appreciate even basic wheelchair and its various functionalities. Its simpler than bike for sure, but its also foldable (at least mine) and relatively easy to pack into trunk of any decent car in a minute (not for me of course but accompanying person).

Re: A $1k Wheelchair

#289

Post by [deleted] »

jillesvangurp wrote: post #242

I just did a search for wheelchairs on the German version of Amazon. I'm not in the market but I was just curious. https://www.amazon.de/-/en/gp/bestsellers/drugstore/28602980... There are lots of models with very reasonable prices and features; mostly well below 1000 euros. Including a few electric ones. Manual ones seem to be generally well below 500 euros. At 1000 euros we're talking some seriously tricked out mod…

[deleted]

Re: A $1k Wheelchair

#290

Post by giorgioz »

bradley13 wrote: post #278
fotta wrote: post #16

Custom fit lightweight wheelchairs are expensive. My Ti-Lite (one of the most popular lightweight chair brands) Aero Z starts at $3k and goes up quickly with wheels and backrest and casters and various other options that I need for sitting 16 hours a day without creating more problems. Insurance covers this for me every 5 years, but of course that's not a luxury every one has. Most plans don't cover DME 100%. What Za…

A manual wheelchair is less complex than a bicycle, and I can get a decent bicycle for a few hundred bucks. The fact that basic wheelchairs are crazy expensive has little to do with the chairs and a lot to do with insane bureaucracy.

And also economy of scale, there are 1 billion bikes in the world VS 65 million wheelchairs.
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