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Gavin Newsom vetoes SB 1047

gov.ca.gov

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Re: Gavin Newsom vetoes SB 1047

#51
post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only applying to the biggest models is the point ; the biggest models are the inherently high-risk ones. The larger they get, the more that running them at all is the "high-risk situation". Passing this would not have been a complete solution, but it would have been a step in the right direction. This is a huge disappointment.

> running them at all is the "high-risk situation" What is the actual, concrete concern here? That a model "breaks out", or something? The risk with AI is not in just running models, the risk is becoming overconfident in them, and then putting them in charge of real-world stuff in a way that allows them to do harm. Hooking a model up to an effector capable of harm is a deliberate act requiring assurance that it doesn…

That is one risk. Humans at the other end of the screen are effectors; nobody is worried about AI labs piping inference output into /dev/null.

Re: Gavin Newsom vetoes SB 1047

#52
Excellent move by Newsom. We have a very active legislature, but it's been extremely bandwagon-y in recent years. I support much of Wiener's agenda, particularly his housing policy, but this bill was way off the mark.

It was basically a torpedo against open models. Market leaders like OpenAI and Anthropic weren't really worried about it, or about open models in general. Its supporters were the also-rans like Musk [1] trying to empty out the bottom of the pack, as well as those who are against any AI they cannot control, such as antagonists of the West and wary copyright holders.

[1] https://techcrunch.com/2024/08/26/elon-musk-unexpectedly-off...

Re: Gavin Newsom vetoes SB 1047

#53
post #29

https://legiscan.com/CA/text/SB1047/id/3019694 So this is the one that would make it illegal to provide open weights for models past a certain size, would make it illegal to sell enough compute power to train such a model without first verifying that your customer isn't going to train a model and then ignore this law, and mandates audit requirements to prove that your models won't help people cause disasters and can…

The proposed law was so egregiously stupid that if you live in California, you should seriously consider voting for Anthony Weiner's opponent in the next election. The man cannot be trusted with power -- this is far from the first ridiculous law he has championed. Notably, he was behind the (blatantly unconstitutional) AB2098, which was silently repealed by the CA state legislature before it could be struck down by t…

>you should want more thoughtful representation than this.

Your opinion on what "thoughtful representation" is is what makes this point partisan. Regardless, he's in until 2028 so it'll be some time before that vote can happen.

Also, important Nitpick, it's Scott Weiner. Anthony Weiner (no relation AFAIK) was in New York and has a much more... Public controversy.

Re: Gavin Newsom vetoes SB 1047

#54
post #29

https://legiscan.com/CA/text/SB1047/id/3019694 So this is the one that would make it illegal to provide open weights for models past a certain size, would make it illegal to sell enough compute power to train such a model without first verifying that your customer isn't going to train a model and then ignore this law, and mandates audit requirements to prove that your models won't help people cause disasters and can…

The proposed law was so egregiously stupid that if you live in California, you should seriously consider voting for Anthony Weiner's opponent in the next election. The man cannot be trusted with power -- this is far from the first ridiculous law he has championed. Notably, he was behind the (blatantly unconstitutional) AB2098, which was silently repealed by the CA state legislature before it could be struck down by t…

you've got the wrong Weiner dude ;)

Re: Gavin Newsom vetoes SB 1047

#55
I wondered if the article was over-dramatizing what risks were covered by the bill, so I read the text:

(g) (1) “Critical harm” means any of the following harms caused or materially enabled by a covered model or covered model derivative:

(A) The creation or use of a chemical, biological, radiological, or nuclear weapon in a manner that results in mass casualties.

(B) Mass casualties or at least five hundred million dollars ($500,000,000) of damage resulting from cyberattacks on critical infrastructure by a model conducting, or providing precise instructions for conducting, a cyberattack or series of cyberattacks on critical infrastructure.

(C) Mass casualties or at least five hundred million dollars ($500,000,000) of damage resulting from an artificial intelligence model engaging in conduct that does both of the following:

(i) Acts with limited human oversight, intervention, or supervision.

(ii) Results in death, great bodily injury, property damage, or property loss, and would, if committed by a human, constitute a crime specified in the Penal Code that requires intent, recklessness, or gross negligence, or the solicitation or aiding and abetting of such a crime.

(D) Other grave harms to public safety and security that are of comparable severity to the harms described in subparagraphs (A) to (C), inclusive.

(2) “Critical harm” does not include any of the following:

(A) Harms caused or materially enabled by information that a covered model or covered model derivative outputs if the information is otherwise reasonably publicly accessible by an ordinary person from sources other than a covered model or covered model derivative.

(B) Harms caused or materially enabled by a covered model combined with other software, including other models, if the covered model did not materially contribute to the other software’s ability to cause or materially enable the harm.

(C) Harms that are not caused or materially enabled by the developer’s creation, storage, use, or release of a covered model or covered model derivative.

Re: Gavin Newsom vetoes SB 1047

#56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This guy is a menace. Among his other recent bills are ones to require cars not be able to go more than 10mph over the speed limit (watered down to just making a terrible noise when they do) and to decriminalize intentionally giving someone AIDs. I know this sounds like hyperbole.. how could this guy keep getting elected?? But its not, it's california!

Scott Wiener is literally a demon in human form.

[deleted]

Re: Gavin Newsom vetoes SB 1047

#57

Given what Scott Wiener did with restaurant fees, it's hard to trust his judgement on any legislation. He clearly prioritizes monied interests over the general populace.

This guy is a menace. Among his other recent bills are ones to require cars not be able to go more than 10mph over the speed limit (watered down to just making a terrible noise when they do) and to decriminalize intentionally giving someone AIDs. I know this sounds like hyperbole.. how could this guy keep getting elected?? But its not, it's california!

Technically you can't go over 5mph of the speed limit. And that's only because of radar accuracy.

Of course no one cares until you get a bored cop one day. And with free way traffic you're lucky to hit half the speed limit.

Re: Gavin Newsom vetoes SB 1047

#58

https://legiscan.com/CA/text/SB1047/id/3019694 So this is the one that would make it illegal to provide open weights for models past a certain size, would make it illegal to sell enough compute power to train such a model without first verifying that your customer isn't going to train a model and then ignore this law, and mandates audit requirements to prove that your models won't help people cause disasters and can…

> and mandates audit requirements to prove that your models won't help people cause disasters Audits cannot prove anything and they offer no value when planning for the future. They're purely a retrospective tool that offers insights into potential risk factors. > and can be turned off. I really wish legislators would operate inside reality instead of a Star Trek episode.

> Audits cannot prove anything and they offer no value when planning for the future. They're purely a retrospective tool that offers insights into potential risk factors.

What if it audits your deploy and approval processes? They can say for example, that if your AI deployment process doesn't include stress tests against some specific malicious behavior (insert test cases here) then you are in violation of the law. That would essentially be a control on all future deploys.

Re: Gavin Newsom vetoes SB 1047

#59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not about current LLMs, it's about future, much more advanced models, that are capable of serious hacking or other mass-casualty-causing activities. o-1 and AlphaProof are proofs of concept for agentic models. Imagine them as GPT-1. The GPT-4 equivalent might be a scary technology to let roam the internet. It would have no effect on current models.

It looks like it would cover an ordinary chatbot than can answer "how do I $THING" questions, where $THING is both very bad and is also beyond what a normal person could dig up with a search engine. It's not based on any assumptions about the future models having any capabilities beyond providing information to a user.

Things you could dig up with a search engine are explicitly not covered, see my other comment quoting the bill (ctrl+f critical harm).

Re: Gavin Newsom vetoes SB 1047

#60
post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Only applying to the biggest models is the point ; the biggest models are the inherently high-risk ones. The larger they get, the more that running them at all is the "high-risk situation". Passing this would not have been a complete solution, but it would have been a step in the right direction. This is a huge disappointment.

> running them at all is the "high-risk situation" What is the actual, concrete concern here? That a model "breaks out", or something? The risk with AI is not in just running models, the risk is becoming overconfident in them, and then putting them in charge of real-world stuff in a way that allows them to do harm. Hooking a model up to an effector capable of harm is a deliberate act requiring assurance that it doesn…

Well this is exactly why there's a minimum scale of concern. Below a certain scale it's less complicated and answers are more predictable and alignment can be ensured. Bigger models how do you determine your confidence if you don't know what's it's thinking? There's already evidence in o1 red-teaming, the model was trying to game the researcher's checks.
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