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Role of Deliberate Practice in the Development of Creativity (2014)

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Re: Role of Deliberate Practice in the Development of Creativity (2014)

#71
"[My parents and I] were enthralled by the same music, but it showed us different things. I listened to Slash’s flamboyant, searching guitar solo on “November Rain” and heard liberation, a suggestion that crazed, committed vision could carry you away, somewhere else. To my parents, Slash’s greatness was evidence of virtuoso skill, the product of thousands of hours of study and practice."

- Hua Hsu, "Stay True: A Memoir"

Re: Role of Deliberate Practice in the Development of Creativity (2014)

#72
One of the great variables is the manner of practice. Every so-called virtuoso guitar player has spent thousands of hours with their hands on the instrument. But where one such celebrity may have used a 10-hour-per-day practice routine in their teens, another may instead have taken drugs then listened to music and jammed with his like-minded friends at every opportunity. Very different forms of expertise results.

Quality of practice is another factor. It's possible to become very good at doing things the wrong way, then belatedly realise that progress has been unintentionally stunted. And even that is not clear-cut. Sometimes 'the wrong way' is lauded as creative discovery, and other times simply as reduced competence.

Re: Role of Deliberate Practice in the Development of Creativity (2014)

#73

One of the great variables is the manner of practice. Every so-called virtuoso guitar player has spent thousands of hours with their hands on the instrument. But where one such celebrity may have used a 10-hour-per-day practice routine in their teens, another may instead have taken drugs then listened to music and jammed with his like-minded friends at every opportunity. Very different forms of expertise results. Qua…

> It's possible to become very good at doing things the wrong way, then belatedly realise that progress has been unintentionally stunted.

And sometimes when that happens, I've seen people say "I'll just stick with this way, since I think my skills would dip too much for too long while re-learning this technique the 'right' way."

Re: Role of Deliberate Practice in the Development of Creativity (2014)

#74
post #2

> In order to assess the difference between deliberate practice habits between elite-level performers and moderate-level performers, it was also necessary to recruit moderate-level performers. Hehe :) Edit: Very interesting read, with nice examples of both successful and unsuccessful artists in various fields. One key trait in becoming successful seems to be willing to put in the effort. This in turn seems to only wo…

I think that's exactly right.

When I began studying jazz drumming I was working from a DVD by John Riley. At one point he makes this statement about what it means to be 'gifted' at drumming (but it applies to anything).

He says the 'gift' is less about a physical attribute, and more about a disposition or temperament. I.e., you're so passionate about something that you're willing to spend countless hours, days, years learning to do something you can't do, simply because you find that process the most enjoyable.

I appreciated that perspective so much I snipped it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ist7xECbDh0

Re: Role of Deliberate Practice in the Development of Creativity (2014)

#75

> Elite level performers use deliberate practice and credit hard work to their success instead of talent. > Mediocre performers don't use deliberate practice and credit talent to their success. The author then implies that deliberate practice and hard work are the key to success. But it could also be the case that elite level performers _are_ talented and they achieve success by exploiting that talent through hard wo…

Depends on how you define success. If it's Olympic gold or bust .. you're gonna have a bad time.

Given the 2 x 2 matrix of natural talent and ability to focus/ give effort / practice deliberately (whatever you want to call it)

High High > superstars, top 0.1%

Low Low > duh

High Low > flame outs, weeded our early from higher tracks, big fish in small ponds

Low High > stars (not super), top 10%

Showing up really does count for a lot. It absolutely leads to "success" even if not the highest stratosphere.

Re: Role of Deliberate Practice in the Development of Creativity (2014)

#76

One of the great variables is the manner of practice. Every so-called virtuoso guitar player has spent thousands of hours with their hands on the instrument. But where one such celebrity may have used a 10-hour-per-day practice routine in their teens, another may instead have taken drugs then listened to music and jammed with his like-minded friends at every opportunity. Very different forms of expertise results. Qua…

Many creative pursuits are compound skills, and individual skill elements must work together effectively. Many types of practice advice describe isolating one skill element to improve it, but if overdone that leads to a bad outcome, where that skill dominates and overall performance is blocked.

As a guitar player who is modestly ok at basic jazz, all the pattern-based rock stuff I spent years on is now an impediment. I have to unlearn it and approach the instrument like a beginner, but with a different intention.

So in some ways I’m reversing out of a cul de sac.

Re: Role of Deliberate Practice in the Development of Creativity (2014)

#77

Having someone around you who either intentionally or unintentionally creates an environment that makes you want to, and therefor enjoy putting in the effort, is crucial. I am just finishing up The Talent Code by Daniel Coyle [0] and it has been an interesting short read. In a nutshell, it boils talent down deep practice, ignition, and master coaching. [0] https://www.goodreads.com/en/book/show/5771014-the-talent-co.…

I am a counter example that rule (though perhaps it is indirectly in agreement). I grew up alone, in the middle of the UK countryside without much regular contact with other kids. My inner monologue grew constant and loud - it acted like a companion, urging me to create things and ideas.

Similar situation. The book does delineate between certain activities and how they're reinforced/guided- so I'm not sure your example is a counter-example. It actually fits the narrative of the book quite well. For example, it uses Futsol as an example of a sport that is self-reinforcing: you do the right things, you keep the ball and get a goal- if not, it gets taken from you. In contrast, a student playing the piano is much more successful with an experienced teacher to guide the rights and wrongs.

Re: Role of Deliberate Practice in the Development of Creativity (2014)

#78
I think that deiliberate practice is needed to refine and improve the execution of actual physicaly tangeble artifacts of the creative impulse,but the creative impulse comes first unbiden and often the "deiliberate practice" is anything but,and is rather an unstopable compulsion different levels and outcomes,d8fferent drives and aims and also must be recognised as an almost universal drive,that exists in other species bower birds and chimp fads "stick in ear" is my favorite,which I actualy practice occasionaly the unique tribal hunting practices of killer whale pods,some of which are truely extreem like the wave surfing onto a beach to grab a seal and the wiggle back into the ocean thinking that up was an exceptiinaly creative process so...

Re: Role of Deliberate Practice in the Development of Creativity (2014)

#79
post #70
post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why did it get flagged? Is it not allowed to post links in comments? Or drive links specifically?

"Here's what an LLM thinks about this" is not useful commentary, it's just white noise

I disagree.

There, now we both have an opinion.

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