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I Am Tired of AI

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Re: I Am Tired of AI

#621

Post by kerkeslager »

gizmo wrote: post #33

AI writing is pretty bad, AI code is pretty bad, AI art is pretty bad. We all know this. But it's easy to forget how many new opportunities open up when something becomes 100x or 10000x cheaper. Things that are 10x worse but 100x cheaper are still extremely valuable. It's the relentless drive to making things cheaper, even at the expense of quality, that has made our high quality of life possible. You can make houses…

I think that your post misses the point that making something cheaper by stealing it is unethical.

You're presenting AI as if it's some new way of producing value but it simply isn't. All the value here was produced by humans without the help of AI: the only "innovation" AI has offered is making the theft of that value untraceable.

> You can make houses by hand out of beautiful hardwood with complex joinery. Houses built by expert craftsmen are easily 10x better than the typical house built today. But what difference does that make when practically nobody can afford it? Just like nobody can afford to have a 24/7 tutor that speaks every language, can help you with your job, grammar check your work, etc.

Let's take this analogy to its logical conclusion: would you have any objections if all the houses ever built by expert craftsmen were given free of charge to a few corporations, with no payment to the current owners or the expert craftsmen themselves, and then then those corporations began renting them out as AirBnBs? That's basically what you're proposing.

Re: I Am Tired of AI

#622

Post by [deleted] »

amiantos wrote: post #577
fallingknife wrote: post #10

I'm not. I think it's awesome and I can't wait to see what comes out next. And I'm completely OK with all of my work being used to train models. Bunch of luddites and sour grapes around here on HN these days.

There's _a lot_ of poor quality engineers out there who understand that on some level they are committing fraud by spinning their wheels all day shifting CSS values around on a React component while collecting large paychecks. I think it's only natural all of those engineers are terrified by the prospect of some computer being capable of doing their job quickly and efficiently and replacing them. Those people are cry…

[deleted]

Re: I Am Tired of AI

#623

Post by AlexDragusin »

scotty79 wrote: post #44

AI was just trained so far to generate corporate bs speak in a corporate bs format. That's why it's tiring. More unique touch in communication will come later as fine tunings and loras (if possible) of those models are shared.

I beg to differ, one has to use the tool properly towards the desired results, for that, one has to understand and know the capabilities and limitations of the tool, for instance got my Plumber AI (local Llama 3.1 8B) to give his opinion on AI, I think it did a pretty good job and certainly not corporate :)

"Blimey, I've been thinkin' about this AI business a lot lately. I mean, I'm a plumber, I fix pipes, I don't get involved in all this fancy tech stuff, but it's hard to ignore. I was talkin' to a mate who's into that sort of thing and he's got me worried. He says these AI systems are gonna be takin' over, doin' all the work while we sit back and collect our pensions.

Now, I'm not sure I agree. I mean, I've seen some of these AI systems in action and they're not exactly the most reliable things, if you know what I mean. I've had to fix more than a few pipes that were clogged up by some dodgy software or other. And what's the point of havin' a system that's smarter than us if it's just gonna break down and need fixin' all the time?

But, I suppose that's just the old plumber in me comin' out. I mean, I know some folks who are workin' with AI and they say it's the future, that we're all gonna be replaced by robots and whatnot. And I suppose that's a bit scary, but I'm not sure I buy it. I mean, what's the harm in havin' a bit of intelligence to help us out? As long as it's not too smart, if you know what I mean.

Anyway, that's my two pence on AI. Take it or leave it, I don't care. I'm just gonna go fix some pipes and let the tech wizards sort it out."

Challenged it with: What do you mean "clogged up by some dodgy software" how does software clogs pipes?

"That was a bit of a stretch, wasn't it? As a plumber, I'm more used to dealing with physical blockages in pipes, like grease or hair, rather than software.

What I was trying to get at was that I've had to fix pipes that were faulty or malfunctioning due to poor design or manufacturing, and that's what I meant by "clogged up by some dodgy software". But that's a bit of a misnomer, isn't it?

In reality, I was just trying to come up with a way to relate my plumbing experience to the idea of AI systems being unreliable. But I think I ended up stretching a bit too far! Maybe I'll stick to talking about pipes and not try to get too clever with my analogies."

Re: I Am Tired of AI

#624

Post by defgeneric »

sovietmudkipz wrote: post #4

I am tired and hungry… The thing I’m tired of is elites stealing everything under the sun to feed these models. So funny that copyright is important when it protects elites but not when a billion thefts are committed by LLM folks. Poor incentives for creators to create stuff if it just gets stolen and replicated by AI. I’m hungry for more lawsuits. The biggest theft in human history by these gang of thieves should be…

Perhaps what we should be pushing for is a law that would force full disclosure regarding the training corpus and require a curated version of the training data to be made available. I'm sure there would be all kinds of unintended consequences of a law like that but maybe we'd be better off starting from a strong basis and working out those exceptions. While billions have been spent to train these models, the value of the millions of human hours spent creating the content they're trained on should likewise be recognized.

Re: I Am Tired of AI

#625

Post by davidhaymond »

sandworm101 wrote: post #208
low_tech_love wrote: post #27

The most depressing thing for me is the feeling that I simply cannot trust anything that has been written in the past 2 years or so and up until the day that I die. It's not so much that I think people have used AI, but that I know they have with a high degree of certainty, and this certainty is converging to 100%, simply because there is no way it will not. If you write regularly and you're not using AI, you simply…

>> cannot trust anything that has been written in the past 2 years or so and up until the day that I die. You never should have. Large amounts of work, even stuff by major authors, is ghostwritten. I was talking to someone about Taylor Swift recently. They thought that she wrote all her songs. I commented that one cannot really know that, that the entertainment industry is very going at generating seemingly "authenti…

While I do enjoy some popular genres, I'm all too aware of the massive industry behind it all. I believe that most of humanity's greatest works of art were created not for commercial interests but rather for the pure joy of creation, of human expression. This can be found in any genre if you look hard enough, but it's no accident that the music I find the most rewarding is classical music: Intellect, emotion, spirit, and narrative dreamed into existence by one person and then brought to life by other artists so we can share in its beauty.

I think music brings about a connection between the composers, lyricists, performers, and listeners. Music lets us participate in something uniquely human. Replacing any of the human participants with AI greatly diminishes or eliminates its value in my eyes.

Re: I Am Tired of AI

#626

Post by amatecha »

drstewart wrote: post #436
sovietmudkipz wrote: post #4

I am tired and hungry… The thing I’m tired of is elites stealing everything under the sun to feed these models. So funny that copyright is important when it protects elites but not when a billion thefts are committed by LLM folks. Poor incentives for creators to create stuff if it just gets stolen and replicated by AI. I’m hungry for more lawsuits. The biggest theft in human history by these gang of thieves should be…

>elites stealing everything > a billion thefts >The biggest theft >what’s been stolen I do like how the internet has suddenly acknowledged that pirating is theft and torrenting IS a criminal activity. To your point, I'd love to see a massive operation to arrest everyone who has downloaded copyrighted material illegal (aka stolen), for the public interest.

This is such a misrepresentation of the issue and what people are saying about it. They call it "theft" because corps are, apparently-indiscriminately and without remuneration of creators, "ingesting" the original work of thousands or millions of individuals, in order to provide for-profit services derived from that ingestion/training. "Pirates", on the other hand, copy content for their own momentary entertainment, and the exploitation ends there. They aren't turning around and starting a multi-million-dollar business selling pirated content en masse.

Re: I Am Tired of AI

#627

Post by closeparen »

TheOtherHobbes wrote: post #478
Roark66 wrote: post #352

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The most depressing thing for me is the feeling that I simply cannot trust anything that has been written in the past 2 years or so and up until the day that I die Do you think AI has changed that in any way? I remember the sea of excrement overtaking genuine human written content on the Internet around mid 2010s. It is around that time when Google stopped pretending they are a search company and focused on their pr…

Google didn't change it, it embodied it. The problem isn't AI, it's the pervasive culture of PR and advertising which appeared in the 50s and eventually consumed its host. Western industrial culture was based on substance - getting real shit done. There was always a lot of scammery around it, but the bedrock goal was to make physical things happen - build things, invent things, deliver things, innovate. PR and ad cul…

You can outfit an adult life with all of the useful manufactured objects that would reasonably improve it for a not-very-impressive sum. Beyond that it's just clutter (going for quantity) or moving into the lifestyle/taste/social-signaling domain anyway (going for quality). There is just not an unlimited amount of alpha in making physical things. The social/thought/experiential domain is a much bigger opportunity.

Re: I Am Tired of AI

#628

Post by precompute »

akudha wrote: post #419
gizmo wrote: post #33

AI writing is pretty bad, AI code is pretty bad, AI art is pretty bad. We all know this. But it's easy to forget how many new opportunities open up when something becomes 100x or 10000x cheaper. Things that are 10x worse but 100x cheaper are still extremely valuable. It's the relentless drive to making things cheaper, even at the expense of quality, that has made our high quality of life possible. You can make houses…

The bigger problem is that we as a species get used to subpar things quickly. My dad's bicycle some 35 years ago was built like a tank. That thing never broke down and took enormous amounts of abuse and still kept going and going. Same with most stuff my family owned, when I was a kid. Today, nearly anything I buy breaks in a year or two, is of poor quality and depressing to use. This is by design, of course. Just as…

Could not agree more. The marketing for "AI" would have you believe it's a qualitative shift when it's really a quantitative shift.

Re: I Am Tired of AI

#629

Post by precompute »

BeFlatXIII wrote: post #574
KaiserPro wrote: post #224

I too am not looking forward to industrial scale job disruption that AI brings. I used to work in VFX, and one day I want to go back to it. However I suspect that it'll be entirely hollowed out in 2-5 years. The problem is that like typesetting, typewriting or the wordprocessor, LLMs makes writing text so much faster and easier. The arguments about handwriting vs type writer are quite analogous to LLM vs pure hand. P…

> People who are good and fast at handwriting hated the type writer. Everyone else embraced it. My thoughts exactly whenever I see true artists ranting about how everyone hates AI art slop. It simply doesn't align with my observations of people having a great time using it. Delusional wishful thinking.

The march towards progress asks for idealism from the people that make Art (in all forms). It's not about "hating" AISlop, but rather about how it does not allow people to experience better art.

Re: I Am Tired of AI

#630

Post by precompute »

KaiserPro wrote: post #224

I too am not looking forward to industrial scale job disruption that AI brings. I used to work in VFX, and one day I want to go back to it. However I suspect that it'll be entirely hollowed out in 2-5 years. The problem is that like typesetting, typewriting or the wordprocessor, LLMs makes writing text so much faster and easier. The arguments about handwriting vs type writer are quite analogous to LLM vs pure hand. P…

There is a limit, though. Language has become worse with the popularization of social media. Now, thinking will because most people will be content with letting machines think for them. The brain requires stimulation in the areas it wants to excel in, and this expertise informs both action and taste in those areas. If you lose one, you lose both.
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