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Coffee Stats – Maximize Caffeine Intake and Get to Bed at Night

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Re: Coffee Stats – Maximize Caffeine Intake and Get to Bed at Night

#81

Post by dharma1 »

bigiain wrote: post #8
jaggederest wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And there are at least 3 different metabolic rates for caffeine, rapid, standard, and slow. As a holder of the slow gene, none of these calculators work for me since for me caffeine has a ~9 hour half life. Caffeine after about 11 am is a bad plan.

Pretty sure there's some age related effects too. Over the last ~20 years I've gone from being happily able to drink coffee after dinner, through not being able to drink it after 5pm or so, and now to having the espresso machine automatically shut off at 2:30pm - otherwise my sleep quality plummets. I'm 57 now, I started noticing poor sleep related to late night coffee in my mid 30s. I do got fairly hard earlier in t…

Caffeine metabolism becomes less effective as you age

Re: Coffee Stats – Maximize Caffeine Intake and Get to Bed at Night

#82

Post by borg16 »

aantix wrote: post #76

To determine whether you're a slow or fast caffeine metabolizer.. Wait for a sale at Nebula.org. Get your whole genome sequenced. ~$200. Having your whole genome sequenced could have added benefits down the road. Download the .BAM file. It will be several gigabytes. Use WSG Extract to generate the 23andMe raw data files. https://www.geneticlifehacks.com/convert-whole-genome-file/ Connect that data file to Genetic Lif…

this is wonderful.

can i ask how you went about arriving at this workflow?

Re: Coffee Stats – Maximize Caffeine Intake and Get to Bed at Night

#83

Post by petercooper »

smith7018 wrote: post #80
aantix wrote: post #76

To determine whether you're a slow or fast caffeine metabolizer.. Wait for a sale at Nebula.org. Get your whole genome sequenced. ~$200. Having your whole genome sequenced could have added benefits down the road. Download the .BAM file. It will be several gigabytes. Use WSG Extract to generate the 23andMe raw data files. https://www.geneticlifehacks.com/convert-whole-genome-file/ Connect that data file to Genetic Lif…

Thank you for this, I've wanted to do genetic testing for years but don't want it to be stored on anyone's server. Can you explain how it's not stored on any server? Like, you're downloading the .BAM file from Nebula; doesn't that mean they hold onto the data?

Anyone who does the actual sequencing has the data. I think they mean the final service that does the analysis runs locally in the browser. You still need to trust whoever does the sequencing.

Re: Coffee Stats – Maximize Caffeine Intake and Get to Bed at Night

#84

Post by aantix »

wnolens wrote: post #72
aantix wrote: post #69

Please take in to account slow vs fast caffeine metabolizer. "CYP1A2 Gene: Fast or Slow Caffeine Metabolizer?" https://www.geneticlifehacks.com/liver-detox-genes-cyp1a2/ This is one of those subjects where people argue past each "I can drink a cup of coffee and sleep like a baby!" vs "One cup of coffee in the morning and my sleep quality is impacted". And neither understands how the other can have a vastly different…

Oh wow, I'm surprised that this is not common knowledge given how common coffee is. I didn't even know it was a thing. File me under "A cup of coffee feels like a small dose of MDMA"

1) Slow metabolizers of caffeine have an increased risk of hypertension or a cardiac event with coffee consumption. Whereas fast metabolizers may have net positive health benefits from coffee consumption.

2) We genuinely lack fidelity on so much subjects that we confidently pontificate about. I've read several reports that coffee is a "net positive". Imagine niavely following that advice your entire life only to realize you're a slow metabolizer and you've been increasing your risk by consuming?

There probably so many aspects to our lives that have genetic components that no one knows about or acknowledges. Even to the point where people will shame others.

"I don't understand, I can drink a whole pot of coffee before bed and sleep like a baby. You'll be fine."

"I don't understand, why can't you just eat less and exercise more and then maybe you wouldn't be a fatty?"

They have no clue.

Re: Coffee Stats – Maximize Caffeine Intake and Get to Bed at Night

#85

Post by ben7799 »

aantix wrote: post #69

Please take in to account slow vs fast caffeine metabolizer. "CYP1A2 Gene: Fast or Slow Caffeine Metabolizer?" https://www.geneticlifehacks.com/liver-detox-genes-cyp1a2/ This is one of those subjects where people argue past each "I can drink a cup of coffee and sleep like a baby!" vs "One cup of coffee in the morning and my sleep quality is impacted". And neither understands how the other can have a vastly different…

I think people simplify this too much. Fast metabolizer doesn't mean it just doesn't effect you.

I am an ultra-fast metabolizer on CYP1A2 based on genetic tests and yet I can still easily get negative side effects from caffeine. This is not an on/off thing, most of these metabolizers are rated on scale of 4 or 5 levels IIRC. I have been told the understanding of some of these metabolizer tests is not that great. They can test for it but they don't really understand how it changes things that well. The bigger thing with these tests is they point towards people of different genetic backgrounds needing different drugs or different doses of some drugs when it comes to certain treatments and that typical drug guidelines are heavily biased towards male patients with typical Northern European genetic characteristics. If you're an ultra-fast caffeine metabolizer there are apparently some drugs that don't work correctly on you.

I typically try to limit myself to only 2 caffeine drinks a day.

It's possible the tests can be wrong I guess. It's also possible I still metabolize it faster than usual but I have some other thing going on that makes me get jittery or anxious from caffeine easily. I suspect what happens is I just get a rush of the effects and then they wear off faster than usual but with a larger effect.

Re: Coffee Stats – Maximize Caffeine Intake and Get to Bed at Night

#86

Post by aantix »

smith7018 wrote: post #80
aantix wrote: post #76

To determine whether you're a slow or fast caffeine metabolizer.. Wait for a sale at Nebula.org. Get your whole genome sequenced. ~$200. Having your whole genome sequenced could have added benefits down the road. Download the .BAM file. It will be several gigabytes. Use WSG Extract to generate the 23andMe raw data files. https://www.geneticlifehacks.com/convert-whole-genome-file/ Connect that data file to Genetic Lif…

Thank you for this, I've wanted to do genetic testing for years but don't want it to be stored on anyone's server. Can you explain how it's not stored on any server? Like, you're downloading the .BAM file from Nebula; doesn't that mean they hold onto the data?

Nebula.org does the data sequencing.

They support anonymous sequencing.

https://nebula.org/anonymous-seq/

Genetic Life Hacks provides the analysis on a number of health and disease related topics. Their analysis is simply allele matching for any given topic (string comparisons). It's all done within the browser.

https://www.geneticlifehacks.com/faqs-about-genetics/#:~:tex...

Re: Coffee Stats – Maximize Caffeine Intake and Get to Bed at Night

#87

Post by bschmidt1 »

Feature requests:

- Let me save coffees I normally drink on file so I can just choose my regulars: "Temple pour over", "Starbucks Americano", etc. and it knows the ounces and mg of caffeine in that drink.

- Let me define my wake/sleep times, or like the coffees keep a few saved times to easily choose from later.

- After I drank the first coffee, it should ask me if I want another one at the optimal peak (unless it's too near to my sleep hour). Partner with DoorDash to fulfill the order.

- The important part: Because DoorDash drivers will occasionally no-show, or drink the coffee themselves, you'll need some extra cash to cover costs, comp angry customers, etc. so you'll need a Series A. So we need to convert your UI into a ChatGPT wrapper that converses with the user in a friendly way, rather than in the VB6-esque UI I see here (as slick as it is).

Re: Coffee Stats – Maximize Caffeine Intake and Get to Bed at Night

#88

Post by taeric »

aantix wrote: post #76

To determine whether you're a slow or fast caffeine metabolizer.. Wait for a sale at Nebula.org. Get your whole genome sequenced. ~$200. Having your whole genome sequenced could have added benefits down the road. Download the .BAM file. It will be several gigabytes. Use WSG Extract to generate the 23andMe raw data files. https://www.geneticlifehacks.com/convert-whole-genome-file/ Connect that data file to Genetic Lif…

I'm curious if there is a basic set of tests you can do with drinking locally to know one way or the other, as well?

Re: Coffee Stats – Maximize Caffeine Intake and Get to Bed at Night

#89

Post by Y_Y »

aantix wrote: post #76

To determine whether you're a slow or fast caffeine metabolizer.. Wait for a sale at Nebula.org. Get your whole genome sequenced. ~$200. Having your whole genome sequenced could have added benefits down the road. Download the .BAM file. It will be several gigabytes. Use WSG Extract to generate the 23andMe raw data files. https://www.geneticlifehacks.com/convert-whole-genome-file/ Connect that data file to Genetic Lif…

23andme has a "report" about this called Caffeine Consumption. The markers they use are rs4410790 and rs2472297, whereas geneticlifehacks.com talks about rs762551. I'm not sure what to make of that, since that second 23andme one is "near" cyp1a2.

https://you.23andme.com/reports/wellness2.caffeine_consumpti...

Re: Coffee Stats – Maximize Caffeine Intake and Get to Bed at Night

#90

Post by aantix »

taeric wrote: post #88
aantix wrote: post #76

To determine whether you're a slow or fast caffeine metabolizer.. Wait for a sale at Nebula.org. Get your whole genome sequenced. ~$200. Having your whole genome sequenced could have added benefits down the road. Download the .BAM file. It will be several gigabytes. Use WSG Extract to generate the 23andMe raw data files. https://www.geneticlifehacks.com/convert-whole-genome-file/ Connect that data file to Genetic Lif…

I'm curious if there is a basic set of tests you can do with drinking locally to know one way or the other, as well?

Measure your blood pressure.

Measure before consumption. Take three different readings.

Measure at one hour intervals after caffeine consumption.

Fast metabolizers BP should return to baseline within a couple of hours.

Mine would remain elevated for 10-12 hours.

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