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Porsche's idea for a six-stroke internal combustion engine

motor1.com

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Re: Porsche's idea for a six-stroke internal combustion engine

#21

Post by flir »

hnlmorg wrote: post #12
ttwwmm wrote: post #2

[flagged]

Electric cars still consume fossil fuels. It’s just earlier in the pipeline. People love to talk about combustion engines being pollutants but few people talk about just how damaging it is mining for rare metals to make those batteries. Nor how harmful for the environment it is disposing of old batters (we haven’t yet solved the problem of recycling them either). And that’s before you even touch on problems at the po…

> less environmentally friendly once you total up their carbon footprint in full

I'm trying to think of an example, and I'm honestly coming up blank.

Re: Porsche's idea for a six-stroke internal combustion engine

#22

Post by roywiggins »

hnlmorg wrote: post #12
ttwwmm wrote: post #2

[flagged]

Electric cars still consume fossil fuels. It’s just earlier in the pipeline. People love to talk about combustion engines being pollutants but few people talk about just how damaging it is mining for rare metals to make those batteries. Nor how harmful for the environment it is disposing of old batters (we haven’t yet solved the problem of recycling them either). And that’s before you even touch on problems at the po…

> few people talk about just how damaging it is mining for rare metals to make those batteries

thank goodness oil production isn't damaging at all and has zero cost, then

if you're going to talk about mining, every other environmental cost of the fossil fuel lifecycle is fair game. how confident are you that oil and gas come out ahead?

Re: Porsche's idea for a six-stroke internal combustion engine

#24

Post by throwaway48540 »

squarefoot wrote: post #8
ttwwmm wrote: post #2

[flagged]

[flagged]

Lol, I really want to see a 150-year old EURO6 200kw diesel engine coupled with a 150-year old 9-speed automatic dual-clutch allowing me to drive on the 150-year old roads for 4 liters per 100 km at German highway speeds.

BTW, electric cars are older technology than ICE cars.

Re: Porsche's idea for a six-stroke internal combustion engine

#25

Post by goodpoint »

xxs wrote: post #15
hnlmorg wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Electric cars still consume fossil fuels. It’s just earlier in the pipeline. People love to talk about combustion engines being pollutants but few people talk about just how damaging it is mining for rare metals to make those batteries. Nor how harmful for the environment it is disposing of old batters (we haven’t yet solved the problem of recycling them either). And that’s before you even touch on problems at the po…

>how damaging it is mining for rare metals to make those batteries. Even thought I'd agree mass EV would not be carried by the current grid, or that charging density and time is not satisfactory (in most of Europe)... LiFePO4 doesn't contain rare earth metals, unless you count Li for 'rare'.

> Even thought I'd agree mass EV would not be carried by the current grid

In many places putting solar panels on roofs and on parking spaces would solve such issue.

Re: Porsche's idea for a six-stroke internal combustion engine

#26

Post by sheepdestroyer »

lb1lf wrote: post #7
ttwwmm wrote: post #2

[flagged]

Presumably as Porsche is not about efficient transportation; it is about emotion, driving as an experience, making a statement, etc. Chances are there will be - or, at least, Porsche appears to bet there will be - a sufficient number of well-heeled enthusiasts who prefer the sound, smell and vibration of an ICE to the quiet performance of an electric motor. I am really curious to see how this pans out in a generation…

[flagged]

Re: Porsche's idea for a six-stroke internal combustion engine

#27

Post by dyauspitr »

hnlmorg wrote: post #12
ttwwmm wrote: post #2

[flagged]

Electric cars still consume fossil fuels. It’s just earlier in the pipeline. People love to talk about combustion engines being pollutants but few people talk about just how damaging it is mining for rare metals to make those batteries. Nor how harmful for the environment it is disposing of old batters (we haven’t yet solved the problem of recycling them either). And that’s before you even touch on problems at the po…

Maybe now they do but once you get everything on the electric standard it’s a matter of gradually switching over to a fully renewable grid.

Re: Porsche's idea for a six-stroke internal combustion engine

#28

Post by thebruce87m »

hnlmorg wrote: post #12
ttwwmm wrote: post #2

[flagged]

Electric cars still consume fossil fuels. It’s just earlier in the pipeline. People love to talk about combustion engines being pollutants but few people talk about just how damaging it is mining for rare metals to make those batteries. Nor how harmful for the environment it is disposing of old batters (we haven’t yet solved the problem of recycling them either). And that’s before you even touch on problems at the po…

Many of the myths you are posting are busted here: https://www.carbonbrief.org/factcheck-21-misleading-myths-ab...

The national grid in the UK was so fed up with people making claims about the grid capacity it also busted some too: https://www.nationalgrid.com/stories/journey-to-net-zero/ele...

> The highest peak electricity demand in the UK in recent years was 62GW in 2002. Since then, the nation’s peak demand has fallen by roughly 16% due to improvements in energy efficiency.

> Even if we all switched to EVs overnight, we estimate demand would only increase by around 10%. So we’d still be using less power as a nation than we did in 2002, and this is well within the range the grid can capably handle.

> Nevertheless, at National Grid we’re working with the distribution networks, government, the regulator and industry to provide the green energy infrastructure around Britain – the wires, the connections to charge points – to support the needs of a decarbonised transport network into the future.

> In the US, the grid is equally capable of handling more EVs on the roads – by the time 80% of the US owns an EV, this will only translate into a 10-15% increase in electricity consumption.1

Re: Porsche's idea for a six-stroke internal combustion engine

#29

Post by cbeach »

lb1lf wrote: post #7
ttwwmm wrote: post #2

[flagged]

Presumably as Porsche is not about efficient transportation; it is about emotion, driving as an experience, making a statement, etc. Chances are there will be - or, at least, Porsche appears to bet there will be - a sufficient number of well-heeled enthusiasts who prefer the sound, smell and vibration of an ICE to the quiet performance of an electric motor. I am really curious to see how this pans out in a generation…

> performance cars should have ICEs

After driving a fast Tesla, stepping into an ICE performance car feels like going back to a steam engine. A very slow, unresponsive steam engine.

When avid petrolheads try a fast EV and feel the instant torque it will be an epiphany for them. Only the most stubborn will stick with fossil cars.

Re: Porsche's idea for a six-stroke internal combustion engine

#30

Post by guax »

mjamesaustin wrote: post #17
hnlmorg wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Electric cars still consume fossil fuels. It’s just earlier in the pipeline. People love to talk about combustion engines being pollutants but few people talk about just how damaging it is mining for rare metals to make those batteries. Nor how harmful for the environment it is disposing of old batters (we haven’t yet solved the problem of recycling them either). And that’s before you even touch on problems at the po…

Most of these claims are dramatically false. - Electric motors use low amounts of rare earth metals, or in some cases none. Batteries generally don't use them either. - Automotive batteries have been demonstrated as >90% recyclable, far better than most materials we consider "recyclable" today such as plastic - The electric grid has sufficient capacity to onboard millions of electric cars without issue, and will not…

Considering how early we get rid of cars that are still usable. I wonder how well the cost of ownership actually holds over when a battery change can overshadow many years of maintenance of an ICE.

I really think as soon as batteries get even cheaper and denser there will be no chance for ICEs to be dominant but right now the balance is still against the change.

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