Cloudflare misidentifies Hetzner IPs as being located in Iran • Hacker News Board

Re: Cloudflare misidentifies Hetzner IPs as being located in Iran

#201

Post by QuercusMax » Thu, Sep 19, 2024, 3:40 PM UTC

literallycancer wrote: post #87

QuercusMax wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"According to a 2024 analysis by The Washington Post, 60% of low-income countries were under some form of U.S. financial sanction. The analysis also concluded that the U.S. imposes three times as many sanctions as any other country or international body." - from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_sanctions Really quite ridiculous that there are sanctions on something like 1/3 of the world.

Is it? Why should a random third world country be allowed to trade with Russia, Iran, North Korea or China? If anything, it would make sense if there were more sanctions, not less, with how things are going.

Why should they be allowed to trade? Because the US isn't the boss of the entire world?

Re: Cloudflare misidentifies Hetzner IPs as being located in Iran

#202

Post by mopsi » Thu, Sep 19, 2024, 3:52 PM UTC

grishka wrote: post #198

mopsi wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think he mistook your "Russia didn't start the war" as an attempt to blame Ukraine, whereas you were trying do distance population from the government. Nevertheless, that's wrong. The population overwhelmingly supports the war: https://www.levada.ru/cp/wp-content/uploads/2024/08/3.png The support is surprisingly uniform across age groups and urban/rural divide: https://www.levada.ru/cp/wp-content/uploads/2024/08/4.…

> The population overwhelmingly supports the war Yeah right because when someone calls people and asks effectively "do you support the war or do you want to go to jail" you totally get data that is not skewed in any way whatsoever. Being openly against the war is literally illegal.

Levada has addressed this criticism in this article: https://www.levada.ru/en/2023/04/24/are-meaningful-public-op...

In short, speculationg how people "really" think is pointless if they support the war in words and actions. Actions shape the world, not innermost thoughts that are never revealed to anyone. Your anti-war thoughts are worthless if you show up at a munitions factory every morning and produce artillery shells all day long.

Re: Cloudflare misidentifies Hetzner IPs as being located in Iran

#203

Post by aguaviva » Thu, Sep 19, 2024, 3:59 PM UTC

chipdart wrote: post #189

grishka wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If they want to complain, they need to direct their complains to their own regime And get arrested and charged with "discrediting the armed forces", right. Must be nice to write all that from the comfort of your Western home.

> And get arrested and charged with "discrediting the armed forces", right. If you don't register that as a problem but somehow limiting your tourism options is a concern, that is already telling regarding what your priorities are.

You keep coming back to the tourism and inconvenience angle, but if you dial back to what the commenter -- who is also taking a significant risk in talking to us, so that you and I might have some hope of finding out how things are viewed by people in the country who are well-informed and definitely not brainwashed, outside of what the media echo chamber tells us to think -- actually said, that very clearly wasn't their point at all. And the point that they did make was perfectly valid.

Go back and read more carefully please.

(And also: they very obviously do register the problem you're referring to, and there's no way to read their statement otherwise).

Re: Cloudflare misidentifies Hetzner IPs as being located in Iran

#204

Post by chipdart » Thu, Sep 19, 2024, 4:03 PM UTC

grishka wrote: post #199

chipdart wrote: post #189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And get arrested and charged with "discrediting the armed forces", right. If you don't register that as a problem but somehow limiting your tourism options is a concern, that is already telling regarding what your priorities are.

I do register that as a problem but it's the same kind of problem as bad weather. Nothing can be done about it.

> I do register that as a problem but it's the same kind of problem as bad weather. Nothing can be done about it.

Yes there is. From Europe's side, one of the most basic things that can be done is stop taking in tourists from a nation hell-bent on starting wars of invasion with neighboring countries and threaten the whole world with nuclear Armageddon.

Cutting economic ties is also a good strong start.

If those hypothetical tourists don't feel strongly about their own nation conducting genocide or bombing hospitals or blowing up damns then perhaps in the very least they should understand that it's something that can negatively affect them too and perhaps, even for the worst possible reasons such as inconveniencing their travel plans, that should not be something they support.

And yet here we are, arguing that changes in travel plans are unfair while ignoring a full blown existencial war.

Re: Cloudflare misidentifies Hetzner IPs as being located in Iran

#205

Post by mopsi » Thu, Sep 19, 2024, 4:07 PM UTC

47282847 wrote: post #200

grishka wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The population overwhelmingly supports the war Yeah right because when someone calls people and asks effectively "do you support the war or do you want to go to jail" you totally get data that is not skewed in any way whatsoever. Being openly against the war is literally illegal.

Exactly. Even calling it one is. And even if it was true, that opinion would simply be an indicator of the success of government propaganda. (Lies and myths and skewed narratives, not to be confused with gaslighting.)

Russians in Europe - where they have excellent access to free media and are under no such pressure - hold similar views, toned down due to public stigma. They refuse to condemn the war, blame it on Ukrainians, etc. A significant number of people refuse to answer the questions at all; this is something that Levada stresses does not happen with their surveys in Russia.

Take Russians in Latvia, for example:

https://eng.lsm.lv/article/society/society/less-than-half-of... (2022)

https://eng.lsm.lv/article/society/society/13.07.2023-survey... (2023)

Re: Cloudflare misidentifies Hetzner IPs as being located in Iran

#206

Post by chipdart » Thu, Sep 19, 2024, 4:11 PM UTC

grishka wrote: post #198

mopsi wrote: post #196

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think he mistook your "Russia didn't start the war" as an attempt to blame Ukraine, whereas you were trying do distance population from the government. Nevertheless, that's wrong. The population overwhelmingly supports the war: https://www.levada.ru/cp/wp-content/uploads/2024/08/3.png The support is surprisingly uniform across age groups and urban/rural divide: https://www.levada.ru/cp/wp-content/uploads/2024/08/4.…

> The population overwhelmingly supports the war Yeah right because when someone calls people and asks effectively "do you support the war or do you want to go to jail" you totally get data that is not skewed in any way whatsoever. Being openly against the war is literally illegal.

> Yeah right because when someone calls people and asks effectively "do you support the war or do you want to go to jail" you totally get data that is not skewed in any way whatsoever.

That line of argument is old and tired and debunked. We also have witnessed in Europe the sad spectacle that is Russian diasporas throwing protests in support of Russia's invasion of Ukraine, and repeated violent attacks from Russian expats targeting Ukrainian refugees.

https://www.newsweek.com/russians-ukrainian-refugees-attack-...

It's very odd how this whole talk of oppression and free speech crackdowns only surfaces in the context of sanctions.

Re: Cloudflare misidentifies Hetzner IPs as being located in Iran

#207

Post by grishka » Thu, Sep 19, 2024, 4:15 PM UTC

chipdart wrote: post #204

grishka wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do register that as a problem but it's the same kind of problem as bad weather. Nothing can be done about it.

> I do register that as a problem but it's the same kind of problem as bad weather. Nothing can be done about it. Yes there is. From Europe's side, one of the most basic things that can be done is stop taking in tourists from a nation hell-bent on starting wars of invasion with neighboring countries and threaten the whole world with nuclear Armageddon. Cutting economic ties is also a good strong start. If those hypot…

> If those hypothetical tourists don't feel strongly about their own nation

We do feel strongly about it but we can't act on these feelings. The government is not taking any feedback.

Again, it's like screaming into the void at something you can't change, like weather. Except in this case, if you scream loudly enough, you will get arrested and charged with "discrediting the Russian armed forces" or "spreading fake information about the use of Russian armed forces". First time it's a fine, subsequent times it's a felony.

Re: Cloudflare misidentifies Hetzner IPs as being located in Iran

#208

Post by chipdart » Thu, Sep 19, 2024, 4:27 PM UTC

paraknight wrote: post #170

RadiozRadioz wrote: post #37

I'm frequently reminded how thankful I am to live in a country with a strong, positive international reputation. Even ignoring actual quality-of-life stuff associated with where I live - simply not being from a country with a "dodgy" reputation makes many things so much easier. I don't have to think about blocked websites. Companies accept my payments. Couriers ship to me. With my passport, I walk straight to the fro…

For half my life I had an Egyptian passport, and for the other a German passport. Having experienced both sides, that bit of paper is without a doubt the most valuable thing I own. It's hard to quantify the kinds of doors it has opened for me. I was able to get a scholarship to study in the UK that covered home/EU rates (a third of international rates, while I might not have been able to get even a student loan other…

> I see the kind of freedom that I have because of that passport as one of the biggest modern injustices.

I think you're confusing a vague and abstract problem of "injustice" with a very concrete and real difference in ways different countries manage their public services and institutions.

You only listed personal benefits that a country like Germany provides to their citizens and the higher education institutions built up by the UK, and how it contrasts with the ones provided by Egypt.

Quite bluntly, this is a discussion over privileges. Not injustice, but privileges. I assure you that countless people from Germany, UK, the EU, or anywhere in the world, would desperately want to have access to the same opportunities. Depicting this as a matter of being granted a passport is at best survivorship bias, and at worse an affront to those who had it but still weren't lucky enough to benefit from the same opportunities.

Re: Cloudflare misidentifies Hetzner IPs as being located in Iran

#209

Post by voidr » Thu, Sep 19, 2024, 4:43 PM UTC

chipdart wrote: post #162

voidr wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

> European here, Russia is not threatening anyone here, not sure who told you that nonsense. I call bullshit. European here. Even if somehow you somehow ignore Georgia or Ukraine, and turn a blind eye to the baltic nations and pretend that Poland doesn't exist, for decades we can't go a single month without Russia throwing any veiled and not so veiled threat. Either tanks in Berlin in x days, tanks in Lisbon in x wee…

Yeah, no superpower would ever be bothered by another superpower wanting to put bases and missiles next to them....

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cuban_Missile_Crisis

Re: Cloudflare misidentifies Hetzner IPs as being located in Iran

#210

Post by chipdart » Thu, Sep 19, 2024, 4:55 PM UTC

grishka wrote: post #207

chipdart wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I do register that as a problem but it's the same kind of problem as bad weather. Nothing can be done about it. Yes there is. From Europe's side, one of the most basic things that can be done is stop taking in tourists from a nation hell-bent on starting wars of invasion with neighboring countries and threaten the whole world with nuclear Armageddon. Cutting economic ties is also a good strong start. If those hypot…

> If those hypothetical tourists don't feel strongly about their own nation We do feel strongly about it but we can't act on these feelings. The government is not taking any feedback. Again, it's like screaming into the void at something you can't change, like weather. Except in this case, if you scream loudly enough, you will get arrested and charged with "discrediting the Russian armed forces" or "spreading fake in…

> We do feel strongly about it but we can't act on these feelings. The government is not taking any feedback.

That's a problem you need to solve.

Again, it's very telling that this only registers as a concern when the subject of mild inconveniences, such as not benefiting from the privilege of visiting some countries as tourists, is brought up.

It's also very telling that the only argument that's expressed in favour of dropping sanctions against Russia is this puerile expectation that Russian citizens should not be subjected to mild inconveniences. Aren't Ukrainians or Georgians entitled to the same expectations?