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Ask HN: Is there any place on the internet capable of freedom of speech?

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Re: Ask HN: Is there any place on the internet capable of freedom of speech?

#91

Post by asdf1145 »

raxxorraxor wrote: post #87
disambiguation wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's pretty clear what he means by free speech here. In the grey area between legal and illegal are the topics we consider taboo. Many platforms simply censor these subjects, OP wants to understand why. The simplest answer is that content moderation is an unsolved problem and certain topics are expensive to moderate. Freedom of speech matters but so does the culture of conduct. Further, as a site owner you risk your…

Not all sites end up like that. HN is friendly to freedom of speech because the site probably doesn't attract people that are easy to act out when offended or those that like to report people whose content they do not like. Or because of the occasional comment that refocuses a discussion again. I would even argue that some more strongly moderated sites can often even be larger cesspools. You can go to Instagram and s…

HN censors anything they don't like specially about their related startups/companies and is also biased to the left politically speaking

Re: Ask HN: Is there any place on the internet capable of freedom of speech?

#92

Post by DonHopkins »

asdf1145 wrote: post #91
raxxorraxor wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not all sites end up like that. HN is friendly to freedom of speech because the site probably doesn't attract people that are easy to act out when offended or those that like to report people whose content they do not like. Or because of the occasional comment that refocuses a discussion again. I would even argue that some more strongly moderated sites can often even be larger cesspools. You can go to Instagram and s…

HN censors anything they don't like specially about their related startups/companies and is also biased to the left politically speaking

No, HN moderation is just biased to the non-sexist, non-racist, non-homophobic, non-transphobic, non-conspiracy-theorist. It's the right wing's choice that they're biased to the sexist, racist, homophobic, transphobic, and conspiracy theories. Don't blame it on the HN community that they aren't sociopathically biased the same as the right wing and Elon Musk, and don't tolerate all that bigotry. Clean up your own act, and take some responsibility for your own bigotry, instead of blaming others for not tolerating your intolerance and hatred.

Re: Ask HN: Is there any place on the internet capable of freedom of speech?

#94

Post by BobaFloutist »

diggan wrote: post #69
BobaFloutist wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They also as much as said "There's places where you can do this but they're cesspools" which almost makes me feel like the real question is "Is there any way I can have the experience of moderated discussion without any risk of me being moderated?" to which the answer is 100% "Yes, your own forum, but don't be surprised if other people aren't sold on the value proposition."

> Is there any way I can have the experience of moderated discussion without any risk of me being moderated? Another answer to this is "Yes, with proper rules and moderation, you can keep your cake and eat it too". First off, have a rule that every created thread in this forum need to have some sort of "basis for discussion". Any thread that doesn't, gets closed. Secondly, have a rule that states that any posts in th…

What you're missing is that people that complain about a lack of "free speech" on the internet largely aren't upset about moderation run amok, as much as they might want to suggest as much, they're upset about moderation at all.

They want 0 limits on their own speech. None. And that includes people blocking them. They want to have their say, no matter how noxious or unpleasant anyone else finds it. They want to "just ask questions" and "just have an open conversation."

But they absolutely want other people to be moderated. There's no amount of moderation of their that's small enough.

Basically, they're (internet speech) libertarians; they want to reap the benefits of a structured, cultivated society and community without be subject to any of the constraints that make it actually work.

Re: Ask HN: Is there any place on the internet capable of freedom of speech?

#95

Post by petesergeant »

ta1243 wrote: post #74
petesergeant wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Free speech conversations tend to devolve very quickly into americentrism In fairness, the US has about the strongest free-speech protections, so that kind of makes sense?

America has the best version of the American view of free speech, that's true.

Best seems a stretch, they certainly have some of the strongest though.

Re: Ask HN: Is there any place on the internet capable of freedom of speech?

#96

Post by unog »

DonHopkins wrote: post #92
asdf1145 wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

HN censors anything they don't like specially about their related startups/companies and is also biased to the left politically speaking

No, HN moderation is just biased to the non-sexist, non-racist, non-homophobic, non-transphobic, non-conspiracy-theorist. It's the right wing's choice that they're biased to the sexist, racist, homophobic, transphobic, and conspiracy theories. Don't blame it on the HN community that they aren't sociopathically biased the same as the right wing and Elon Musk, and don't tolerate all that bigotry. Clean up your own act,…

[flagged]

Re: Ask HN: Is there any place on the internet capable of freedom of speech?

#97

Post by yqtjnvou »

asdf1145 wrote: post #91
raxxorraxor wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not all sites end up like that. HN is friendly to freedom of speech because the site probably doesn't attract people that are easy to act out when offended or those that like to report people whose content they do not like. Or because of the occasional comment that refocuses a discussion again. I would even argue that some more strongly moderated sites can often even be larger cesspools. You can go to Instagram and s…

HN censors anything they don't like specially about their related startups/companies and is also biased to the left politically speaking

I know. That's the point of my question: what is a place completely unmoderated?

Everywhere that allows free speech now has an angle. Some hide it better than others, and people can't see it.

Re: Ask HN: Is there any place on the internet capable of freedom of speech?

#98

Post by yqtjnvou »

fuzzfactor wrote: post #7

>Is there any place on the internet capable of freedom of speech? >hosting my own servers You might have answered your own question here. Or consider that a baseline, and it still may not allow as much freedom as you have in mind. Plus I don't think there is as much risk of a search engine killing a free-speech utopia unless it was a search engine that brought it to life in the first place, or was keeping it on life…

I am concerned about another problem: To justify their existence, search engines cannot simply ignore certain websites, but what they do is to make them harder to find. There many techniques for this. The average person is not aware of this. I am afraid that current and next generations will simply search for information, and will be fed erroneous ones, instead of the correct ones. This is programming at a global level; the internet as a medium has no borders, has no limits, and not all people are versed in computer science.

Re: Ask HN: Is there any place on the internet capable of freedom of speech?

#99

Post by yqtjnvou »

retropragma wrote: post #23

I actually have a system designed that would fit your desired attributes exactly. I don't know when I'll get to building it, but I do believe what you want is achievable. But that's all I can say, because when it comes to something like this, inventing the system is half the battle.

I wish you good luck in your endeavor. You shouldn't give any details because they are all watching (and waiting). And be careful of your friends (and not enemies).

Re: Ask HN: Is there any place on the internet capable of freedom of speech?

#100

Post by yqtjnvou »

mersenne wrote: post #42

In which platform and on which instances have you felt your freedom of speech to have been restricted?

All of them. This is the purpose of this thread.

I use their moderators to see exactly what their rules are. Long-posts, depicting the situation as-is, no derogatory terms, and all get removed within 1h after posting.

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