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From Myth to Measurement: Rethinking US News and World Report College Rankings

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Re: From Myth to Measurement: Rethinking US News and World Report College Rankings

#11

Post by DiscourseFan »

fsckboy wrote: post #10
DiscourseFan wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The real problem with American universities is that in one generation they have gone from best in the world to completely lost and directionless, having jettisoned their entire curricula in favor of counterintuitive and vapid intellectual fashion, but enough about that, I'm sure you're thinking you need to know my pronouns Like? I'm sure you're deeply familiar with these fashions. And nobody asked for your pronouns,…

> And nobody asked for your pronouns, even if I cared we're on an internet forum. I know, I wasn't mocking you, I was mocking American universities which is where that idea came from

You have no idea, it probably came from tumblr. I'm familiar with those "fashions" to which you refer and not a single professor I know ever teaches about pronouns or anything else which you're probably alluding to.

Re: From Myth to Measurement: Rethinking US News and World Report College Rankings

#12

Post by ineedasername »

Here's an insider's insight: Colleges hate these rankings too, including the shit eating grin they have to plaster on their face when they go out in public and say things like "We're one of the top 10 small public non-land grant research institutions in the upper middle pacific northwest region!"

But too many families have been convinced that rankings like this are useful so now the institutions have little choice but to become complicit in the ridiculous system or have their enrollment decimated and be unable to pay its bills.

Re: From Myth to Measurement: Rethinking US News and World Report College Rankings

#13

Post by sealeck »

DiscourseFan wrote: post #9

I agree mostly with the article, but this stuck out to me >Measure the proportion of graduates who pursue and are accepted into advanced degree programs. (adjusted for field of study so acceptance into medical school > masters in art history) The only reason, however, that medical school is more competitive than an art history masters (to be fair, most paid masters programs aren't super competitive) is because the me…

> The UK, for instance, has the opposite problem, where becoming a doctor is much easier

According to a friend who qualified in the UK and now practices in the US the _process_ of becoming a doctor is much harder in the UK: medical schools in the UK test students holistically (i.e. big exams which test all the topics) whereas American students are tested one module at a time (so lots of cramming).

I agree that gaining acceptance is probably harder though (ish: the UK government subsidises the provision of medical teaching so places are also capped in the UK for financial and capacity reasons).

Re: From Myth to Measurement: Rethinking US News and World Report College Rankings

#14

Post by fsckboy »

DiscourseFan wrote: post #11
fsckboy wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And nobody asked for your pronouns, even if I cared we're on an internet forum. I know, I wasn't mocking you, I was mocking American universities which is where that idea came from

You have no idea, it probably came from tumblr. I'm familiar with those "fashions" to which you refer and not a single professor I know ever teaches about pronouns or anything else which you're probably alluding to.

any time I get an email from a .edu, it announces pronouns. where it really drives me crazy is dating apps: i spelled out my my preferences, why are you telling me your pronouns? shouldn't I know them by now, unless I clicked "takes all comers" in which case, why would I care? :)

Re: From Myth to Measurement: Rethinking US News and World Report College Rankings

#15

Post by BirAdam »

lotsofpulp wrote: post #7
RecycledEle wrote: post #4

I wish someone would measure the bang-for-the-buck without considering politically correct metrics.

Bang for the buck exists if you get into a top 10 or 20 school where admission standards are so high that people are impressed simply by the fact that you were admitted and/or you get to network with resourceful people. Otherwise, any state university should suffice. A few states have some state schools with very low acceptance rates and difficulty to get in that might serve to advertise/network you better than anoth…

You also network with old money, the politically connected, and the global elite. The “top” universities don’t really need to be better, they just need to have the correct names and the prestige to attract those names. You may have the best professor teaching all the most useful knowledge in the middle of no where state university, but the folks attending won’t have as much opportunity despite their education because they won’t get connected to money or to power.

Re: From Myth to Measurement: Rethinking US News and World Report College Rankings

#16

Post by thaumasiotes »

sealeck wrote: post #13
DiscourseFan wrote: post #9

I agree mostly with the article, but this stuck out to me >Measure the proportion of graduates who pursue and are accepted into advanced degree programs. (adjusted for field of study so acceptance into medical school > masters in art history) The only reason, however, that medical school is more competitive than an art history masters (to be fair, most paid masters programs aren't super competitive) is because the me…

> The UK, for instance, has the opposite problem, where becoming a doctor is much easier According to a friend who qualified in the UK and now practices in the US the _process_ of becoming a doctor is much harder in the UK: medical schools in the UK test students holistically (i.e. big exams which test all the topics) whereas American students are tested one module at a time (so lots of cramming). I agree that gainin…

> medical schools in the UK test students holistically (i.e. big exams which test all the topics)

For reference, "holistic" is the opposite of "objective", not of "specific".

Re: From Myth to Measurement: Rethinking US News and World Report College Rankings

#17

Post by ineedasername »

fsckboy wrote: post #10
DiscourseFan wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>The real problem with American universities is that in one generation they have gone from best in the world to completely lost and directionless, having jettisoned their entire curricula in favor of counterintuitive and vapid intellectual fashion, but enough about that, I'm sure you're thinking you need to know my pronouns Like? I'm sure you're deeply familiar with these fashions. And nobody asked for your pronouns,…

> And nobody asked for your pronouns, even if I cared we're on an internet forum. I know, I wasn't mocking you, I was mocking American universities which is where that idea came from

In terms of daily usage it came first from LGBTQ+ communities. It then gained more mainstream attention when colleges and universities, having to work with the emerging generation where acceptance of different sexualities or identities was more common, began to accommodate this. That was helped along of course by the fact that people who systematically study the constantly changing landscape of language use skew towards researchers in linguistics through colleges and universities. So there were two "vectors" of transfer to that community: from both students and linguists.

Re: From Myth to Measurement: Rethinking US News and World Report College Rankings

#18

Post by ineedasername »

fsckboy wrote: post #14
DiscourseFan wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You have no idea, it probably came from tumblr. I'm familiar with those "fashions" to which you refer and not a single professor I know ever teaches about pronouns or anything else which you're probably alluding to.

any time I get an email from a .edu, it announces pronouns. where it really drives me crazy is dating apps: i spelled out my my preferences, why are you telling me your pronouns? shouldn't I know them by now, unless I clicked "takes all comers" in which case, why would I care? :)

It is frequently policy to do this in an email signature, with the desire to use non-traditional pronouns driven (from what I saw) initially by students themselves. I'm guessing dating apps probably have check boxes or something? If so then it could be necessary or useful if wanting to be exposed or find the broadest group of people that you might click with.

Re: From Myth to Measurement: Rethinking US News and World Report College Rankings

#19

Post by ineedasername »

thaumasiotes wrote: post #16
sealeck wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The UK, for instance, has the opposite problem, where becoming a doctor is much easier According to a friend who qualified in the UK and now practices in the US the _process_ of becoming a doctor is much harder in the UK: medical schools in the UK test students holistically (i.e. big exams which test all the topics) whereas American students are tested one module at a time (so lots of cramming). I agree that gainin…

> medical schools in the UK test students holistically (i.e. big exams which test all the topics) For reference, "holistic" is the opposite of "objective", not of "specific".

It's not the opposite of objective. It is a POV that says that something can best be understood and addressed as a whole rather than by its parts individually. Basically a "greater than sum of parts" thing.

Re: From Myth to Measurement: Rethinking US News and World Report College Rankings

#20

Post by yen223 »

r00fus wrote: post #2

Modern US society seems to be layers upon layers of gamified results with little coherent vision. We blame other countries for having "stifling" regulation, "burdensome" oversight and "top-down" planning, but honestly - it seems we simply let problems precipitate for decades on end and in many cases think it's some sort of achievement.

Don't think you need to single out the US here. Gamification is effective against most human beings.
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