Apple Quietly Pulls Claims of Virus Immunity • Hacker News Board

Re: Apple Quietly Pulls Claims of Virus Immunity

#31

Post by X-Istence » Mon, Jun 25, 2012, 3:07 PM UTC

fjarlq wrote: post #23

crazygringo wrote: post #6

I'm genuinely curious... are there viruses that spread in OSX? Not trojans or whatnot that require users to click on files they shouldn't, but rather actual viruses that make use of vulnerabilities in OSX to spread from computer to computer, either via Internet or thumb drives or something? In other words, if I always follow responsible practices (never opening files from untrusted sources), has there been any threat…

I think the recent Flashback.K qualifies to some degree. All you had to do is visit an infected webpage and the Java applet would walk onto your system. It would immediately ask for admin privileges, but due to the huge Java hole it would have your user privs automatically. Since OSX enabled Java by default, and since responsible practices were no defense, this compromised enough Macs that it was proportionally compa…

And then Apple disabled Java, and Apple no longer ships Java. Java has been a huge security vulnerability for a while now...

Re: Apple Quietly Pulls Claims of Virus Immunity

#32

Post by pgeorgi » Mon, Jun 25, 2012, 3:10 PM UTC

rmc wrote: post #11

recursive wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are macs not PCs? Perhaps I'm an average user, but I thought PC stood for "personal computer".

That depends. To lots of people (myself included), "PC" means "personal computer" and include desktop and laptops from Apple. However in the 1980s/1990s, there were "PCs" and "Macs". PC was anything running Windows (etc.) and a "Mac" was from Apple (i.e. a Macintosh). Apple (and many Apple fans) continue to use "Mac" instead of "PC". I've had Apple fans ask me if I use "a Mac or a PC?" (Since I use Linux, I don't kno…

How about answering "a computer"? :-)

Re: Apple Quietly Pulls Claims of Virus Immunity

#33

Post by jiggy2011 » Mon, Jun 25, 2012, 3:13 PM UTC

Apple seem to be less interested in comparing themselves to MS and PCs in general these days.

In ~2005 their entire marketing was based around trying to sell you a Mac as a PC replacement "Your next PC should be a Mac".

I guess they are less interested now because it's a smaller % of their revenue and most of the people who would want/can afford a Mac are already giving them plenty of money so there's no desperate need to increase their market share in that area.

Re: Apple Quietly Pulls Claims of Virus Immunity

#34

Post by underwater » Mon, Jun 25, 2012, 3:16 PM UTC

crazygringo wrote: post #6

I'm genuinely curious... are there viruses that spread in OSX? Not trojans or whatnot that require users to click on files they shouldn't, but rather actual viruses that make use of vulnerabilities in OSX to spread from computer to computer, either via Internet or thumb drives or something? In other words, if I always follow responsible practices (never opening files from untrusted sources), has there been any threat…

I believe that pwn2own has demonstrated that OSX and Safari are susceptible to drive by attacks; no download is necessary.

Re: Apple Quietly Pulls Claims of Virus Immunity

#35

Post by batista » Mon, Jun 25, 2012, 3:18 PM UTC

muraiki wrote: post #5

Wow, I had no idea that they said stuff like that on their site. Even though it specifies "PC viruses," the average computer user doesn't understand the distinction. Just last night a relative mentioned how Macs don't get viruses (which I corrected).

Well, theoretically they DO get viruses --but practically they don't.

All those past false alarms, touted to high heavens, were trojans. And they aren't even that many, at that. The one genuine virus like thing --which still wasn't a virus as it needed you to visit specific webpages-- infected like 100,000 Macs.

So, assuming ~ 20M Macs, 99.5% of the Macs out there haven't got any virus, ever. And with better OS X support for security (from better address space randomization to sandboxes to gatekeeper, etc), even fewer will get any in the future.

Geeks are quick to point the possibility of virus on Macs (or Linux, for that matter), but in practical terms it's like pointing the possibility of being hit by a thunder. It can happen, it even happened at some people, but normal people shouldn't be that worried about it.

If you disagree, please answer: should Ubuntu users also invest in an Linux antivirus? Because theoretically a virus can also happen there...

It's not the "lack of market share", either. OS 8/9 used to have tons of viruses with a 5 times less marketshare than OS X. Heck, even Amiga/Atari used to have plenty of viruses back in the day, with an insignificant amount of users, and NO actual monetary incentive (no web back then, no credit card details, no bots even).

Re: Apple Quietly Pulls Claims of Virus Immunity

#36

Post by technoslut » Mon, Jun 25, 2012, 3:18 PM UTC

jiggy2011 wrote: post #30

technoslut wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The recent major issue was a trojan that I didn't have. >In other words, if I always follow responsible practices (never opening files from untrusted sources), has there been any threat up through now that could compromise my OSX installation? I don't think so but I think you know that otherwise you would not be here. While this story has been posted recently, Apple has removed such articles on their site a few month…

What about professional ID10Ts?

I won't speak of them. From what I've seen there are enough idiots in this world to go around.

The times that I've heard it was from waiting in line at Best Buy for repairs. Most people wouldn't get it because it is far different when spoken.

Re: Apple Quietly Pulls Claims of Virus Immunity

#37

Post by einhverfr » Mon, Jun 25, 2012, 3:18 PM UTC

brudgers wrote: post #13

According to Sophos U.S. senior technology consultant Graham Cluley, this is a sign that Apple is starting to take security seriously. "I view the changes in the messages pushed out by their marketing department as some important baby-steps," he wrote in a blog entry. The idea that the removal of technical falsehoods from Apple marketing copy represents a watershed moment in their attitude toward the security of thei…

I keep trying to find a way to set it lower but I can't. Maybe someone can help me.

Re: Apple Quietly Pulls Claims of Virus Immunity

#38

Post by einhverfr » Mon, Jun 25, 2012, 3:20 PM UTC

rmc wrote: post #11

recursive wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are macs not PCs? Perhaps I'm an average user, but I thought PC stood for "personal computer".

That depends. To lots of people (myself included), "PC" means "personal computer" and include desktop and laptops from Apple. However in the 1980s/1990s, there were "PCs" and "Macs". PC was anything running Windows (etc.) and a "Mac" was from Apple (i.e. a Macintosh). Apple (and many Apple fans) continue to use "Mac" instead of "PC". I've had Apple fans ask me if I use "a Mac or a PC?" (Since I use Linux, I don't kno…

I usually say "I run Linux."

Re: Apple Quietly Pulls Claims of Virus Immunity

#39

Post by batista » Mon, Jun 25, 2012, 3:21 PM UTC

recursive wrote: post #7

muraiki wrote: post #5

Wow, I had no idea that they said stuff like that on their site. Even though it specifies "PC viruses," the average computer user doesn't understand the distinction. Just last night a relative mentioned how Macs don't get viruses (which I corrected).

Are macs not PCs? Perhaps I'm an average user, but I thought PC stood for "personal computer".

You must have missed the eighties. PC, the acronym, then stood for "IBM PC compatible", not personal computer in general.

You must also have missed 3 years of "I'm a Mac, and I'm a PC" ads...

Re: Apple Quietly Pulls Claims of Virus Immunity

#40

Post by batista » Mon, Jun 25, 2012, 3:23 PM UTC

duiker101 wrote: post #8

recursive wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are macs not PCs? Perhaps I'm an average user, but I thought PC stood for "personal computer".

you know... "Think different". They cannot have even the smallest thing in common... or at least that's what they want people to think.

Really? That must be why when they switched to Intel they touted the compatibility, and why the even offer a utility called "BootCamp" to easily run Windows on your Mac, with automatic re-partitioning, hw drivers, et al.