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How on-the-wrist sleep apnea detection works

empirical.health

11–20 of 170 posts

Re: How on-the-wrist sleep apnea detection works

#11
post #10

I’ve always wished I could put Apple Watch into a “constant oxygen monitor mode” for sleep. That seems to be the obvious way to assess sleep apnea. Anyone know why that isn’t the method?

If I had to venture a guess, maybe it's an industry regulation or power usage issue. Simply being able to assess sleep apnea isn't enough, it has to pass the regulatory burdens as well.

Re: How on-the-wrist sleep apnea detection works

#12
post #2

Considering they use accelerometer for it, nothing really stops them from adding this feature to all Apple Watches, potentially even the Series 1, right? Reserving it to Series 10 and 9 really exposes their lack of hardware innovation. I mean, we were talking about them measuring glucose levels for years and this is what we get as a new flagship feature?

nothing really stops them from adding this feature to all Apple Watches…

I’m confident there’s more to it than just sensor availability. Compute power for starters, as well as the fact that a Series 1 accelerometer may not have the necessary resolution, etc.

Reserving it to Series 10 and 9 really exposes their lack of hardware innovation.

Ah, the ol’ “Apple didn’t build what I want, ergo, Apple doesn’t innovate” trope.

Re: How on-the-wrist sleep apnea detection works

#13
post #3
post #2

Considering they use accelerometer for it, nothing really stops them from adding this feature to all Apple Watches, potentially even the Series 1, right? Reserving it to Series 10 and 9 really exposes their lack of hardware innovation. I mean, we were talking about them measuring glucose levels for years and this is what we get as a new flagship feature?

I suspect they also need oxygen saturation (introduced in the Apple Watch Series 6 in 2020) in order to make their overall sleep apnea detection algorithm work. Given that it only works with the Series 9 or above, it's possible they're also using the the temperature sensor as another input into their algorithm.

They explicitly only mentioned accelerometer. If they used more sensors, in particular temperature sensor, it's hard to imagine they wouldn't mention in, especially that it would justify them limiting the feature to Series 9 and 10.

However, reading on PAT (Peripheral arterial tone) and existing FDA-approved devices using that, they indeed use oxygen but not temperature. See for example "WatchPAT ONE" device.

Re: How on-the-wrist sleep apnea detection works

#14
post #10

I’ve always wished I could put Apple Watch into a “constant oxygen monitor mode” for sleep. That seems to be the obvious way to assess sleep apnea. Anyone know why that isn’t the method?

They still don't have the regular oxygen monitor mode back yet because of a patent dispute. That might be part of it.

Re: How on-the-wrist sleep apnea detection works

#15
post #8

The gatekeeping in the CPAP field is so insane. 1. Yes, we should regulate manufacturers intensely. 2. No, we shouldn't regulate to whom companies should be allowed to sell them. The defaults are good enough for most. Provide an easy to use control for max pressure and people will figure it out. Perhaps a knob? I claim: During the past decade, the risk of being maltreated by a personally set-up CPAP unit has been far…

The health industry as a whole is insane. I support the use of regulation and law where it ensures safety and efficacy but in the U.S. it's currently a patent and legal minefield. So much of it comes directly from special interests who want gatekeeping to keep out new/disruptive competition.

Re: How on-the-wrist sleep apnea detection works

#16
post #2

Considering they use accelerometer for it, nothing really stops them from adding this feature to all Apple Watches, potentially even the Series 1, right? Reserving it to Series 10 and 9 really exposes their lack of hardware innovation. I mean, we were talking about them measuring glucose levels for years and this is what we get as a new flagship feature?

nothing really stops them from adding this feature to all Apple Watches… I’m confident there’s more to it than just sensor availability. Compute power for starters, as well as the fact that a Series 1 accelerometer may not have the necessary resolution, etc. Reserving it to Series 10 and 9 really exposes their lack of hardware innovation. Ah, the ol’ “Apple didn’t build what I want, ergo, Apple doesn’t innovate” trop…

That's manipulative. I did not mention I expected anything in particular. If anything, your defensive narrative makes you come off as a fanboy.

Re: How on-the-wrist sleep apnea detection works

#17
post #14
post #10

I’ve always wished I could put Apple Watch into a “constant oxygen monitor mode” for sleep. That seems to be the obvious way to assess sleep apnea. Anyone know why that isn’t the method?

They still don't have the regular oxygen monitor mode back yet because of a patent dispute. That might be part of it.

That's only in the US, right?

(My flimsy understanding is that blood oxygen measurement is how at-home sleep studies work?)

Re: How on-the-wrist sleep apnea detection works

#20
post #2

Considering they use accelerometer for it, nothing really stops them from adding this feature to all Apple Watches, potentially even the Series 1, right? Reserving it to Series 10 and 9 really exposes their lack of hardware innovation. I mean, we were talking about them measuring glucose levels for years and this is what we get as a new flagship feature?

Sure it probably comes down to sensor specs, but the same question can be asked about Apple Ingtelligence and the new iPhones. If the model is in a private cloud, why is it restricted to newer iPhones? Surely the preprocessing isn't so intensive that only the latest iPhones can do it. It's artificial segmentation in the interest of driving (historically weakening) sales.
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