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The "email is authentication" pattern

rubenerd.com

11–20 of 474 posts

Re: The "email is authentication" pattern

#11
Some apps enforce this flow, e.g. there is no way to log in with a password. I hate this.

Because of the developers of these apps assuming that E-mail guarantees instant delivery (it doesn't), I can't use greylisting, which reduced spam very significantly.

Re: The "email is authentication" pattern

#12

People have already been building auth flows that take this password amnesia into consideration. Look at Anthropic. It's just one way of doing auth and I personally hate it.

I use a password manager. I don't like flipping back to my email, I already have a secure password.

Re: The "email is authentication" pattern

#13

As long as the email account is secure, and the throw-away one-time passwords are good, you have the frequent-rotation passwords security advocates dream about. Indeed, hand them a secure password they have to use (and forget).

I just made it an option in the "I don't have a password" form that instead of setting a password it just logs them in. So they don't even see / have a password to remember.

Re: The "email is authentication" pattern

#14
Because websites used emails as an identity, strictly in order to stop malicious use.

An email ties a user to a domain, the domain issues a user for them. If too many users from a domain are malicious, the website can block the domain.

It's a matter of identity and accountability.

Re: The "email is authentication" pattern

#15

I’ll be hyperbolic and say the login flow is identical. A) Go to website, click through a password manager to copy and paste an arbitrary string of characters, receive TOTP request sent to your email to confirm your identity. Or B) Go to website, click forgot my password. Receive link to login. Enter an arbitrary string of characters. In many instances, login flow B is actually quicker and seldom slower. Clicking the…

Who copy and pastes from a password manager?

Here’s my workflow, and I consider it superior to both of the above.

Go to site, Safari offers to autofill, give TouchID/FaceID, get asked for a 2 factor code.

Sent via SMS/email? Safari offers to autofill for me. TOTP style? Safari offers to autofill for me.

Easy peasy.

Passkeys are even easier as there is no second step and waiting for SMS/email.

Re: The "email is authentication" pattern

#16
post #12

People have already been building auth flows that take this password amnesia into consideration. Look at Anthropic. It's just one way of doing auth and I personally hate it.

I use a password manager. I don't like flipping back to my email, I already have a secure password.

Same here! But for most apps we are probably in the 0,1% or so.

Re: The "email is authentication" pattern

#17
post #12

People have already been building auth flows that take this password amnesia into consideration. Look at Anthropic. It's just one way of doing auth and I personally hate it.

I use a password manager. I don't like flipping back to my email, I already have a secure password.

The most secure password is no password

Re: The "email is authentication" pattern

#18

People have already been building auth flows that take this password amnesia into consideration. Look at Anthropic. It's just one way of doing auth and I personally hate it.

Anthropic and others do this to inconvenience account sharing. It’s not really about auth, it’s about licenses…

Re: The "email is authentication" pattern

#19
post #15

I’ll be hyperbolic and say the login flow is identical. A) Go to website, click through a password manager to copy and paste an arbitrary string of characters, receive TOTP request sent to your email to confirm your identity. Or B) Go to website, click forgot my password. Receive link to login. Enter an arbitrary string of characters. In many instances, login flow B is actually quicker and seldom slower. Clicking the…

Who copy and pastes from a password manager? Here’s my workflow, and I consider it superior to both of the above. Go to site, Safari offers to autofill, give TouchID/FaceID, get asked for a 2 factor code. Sent via SMS/email? Safari offers to autofill for me. TOTP style? Safari offers to autofill for me. Easy peasy. Passkeys are even easier as there is no second step and waiting for SMS/email.

> Who copy and pastes from a password manager?

People who don't use something which integrates with the browser. People who run into the (uncommon but noticeable) edge cases where the password manager decides to not auto fill the password.

Re: The "email is authentication" pattern

#20
post #11

Some apps enforce this flow, e.g. there is no way to log in with a password. I hate this. Because of the developers of these apps assuming that E-mail guarantees instant delivery (it doesn't), I can't use greylisting, which reduced spam very significantly.

Amen, yes. Greylister here too, and password reset/magic links sometimes end up being painfully slow.
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