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A Post-Google World?

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Re: A Post-Google World?

#11

Post by wiseowise »

throwaway48540 wrote: post #8
talldayo wrote: post #5

> Neither case is finished. In the Epic Games case, Judge Donato is likely to come out with a proposed remedy shortly, which will basically force Google to allow other app stores to exist. Android users are all glancing at each other like John Travolta in Pulp Fiction right now.

Except for the Android users who actually tried not using Google Play and know it usually results in a "Play Services are required" error message.

An application written using Play Services requires Play Services - shocking.

Re: A Post-Google World?

#12

Post by [deleted] »

wiseowise wrote: post #10
SoftTalker wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't see how this is a problem. Back in the days when we used to buy software for PCs you could go pick up WordPerfect or Lotus or whatever at any number of bookstores, office supply stores, or mail order outlets. Fundamentally I see no problem with multiple app stores, it will be a boon for developers as the stores will have to compete over how much of a cut they take. Or developers can sell direct.

Android already has alternative app stores.

[deleted]

Re: A Post-Google World?

#13

Post by kmeisthax »

wslh wrote: post #2

Before reading the article, I assumed it was about LLMs. It looks like the regulators have perfectly timed their focus on Google’s business. Is Microsoft laughing at this point?

Only in the narrow sense that Microsoft managed to avoid structural remedies due to Bush Jr. shenanigans that were forgotten because the case was settled three days before 9/11. In the broader sense they've got loads of consent decrees on them, first from the US, then from the EU. They can't even kick CrowdStrike out of the NT kernel!

Even among big tech, Google is an unusually meaty target because:

1. Literally all but two of their consumer product lines are acquisitions. A significant part of their ads network is also acquisitions. Most of those product lines and ad network divisions were preceded by internally-developed business units that were marketplace failures. Google does not build, it buys.

2. Android is FOSS, which neatly tidies away a lot of the "we have a right to monetize our IP" arguments that Apple loves to trot out.

3. They paid Facebook bucket-loads of money to keep them from launching a competing ad network under the "Jedi Blue" program. This is textbook illegal behavior and doesn't require any new theories of antitrust like, say, the Epic lawsuit did.

4. Google doesn't comply with litigation holds. Civil litigation is a Constitution-free zone, you can't take the 5th in this kind of trial, meaning that you can be forced to self-incriminate, and if you do not do so, the judge is free to make adverse inferences.

5. Google doesn't have a single charismatic(?) leader. Apple had Steve Jobs, who could invent the monopolistic business model and then conveniently die[0] before anyone with power started to question it. Google has a bunch of executives that all have to e-mail one another, which means that even with their cavalier attitude towards recordkeeping, something winds up getting recorded, making the missing information even more incriminating.

The one thing I can't answer with this set of answers is why Facebook isn't getting as much scrutiny as Google is, especially since Facebook has proven to be such a good conduit for scammers and disinformation. Facebook has even less ability to leverage "copyright disclaims antitrust" than Google does.

[0] Constitution or no, a judge can't compel a corpse to testify.

Re: A Post-Google World?

#14

Post by ocdtrekkie »

cubefox wrote: post #9
talldayo wrote: post #5

> Neither case is finished. In the Epic Games case, Judge Donato is likely to come out with a proposed remedy shortly, which will basically force Google to allow other app stores to exist. Android users are all glancing at each other like John Travolta in Pulp Fiction right now.

That passage doesn't make sense. Android already allows other app stores, just not entirely without friction. It's iOS which doesn't allow them.

Sort of but not in any practical reality. Besides the scare screens to make any alternatives look like malware, Google has actively paid developers to not compete with the Play Store and launched secret codenamed projects to undermine individual third party stores. Google has even tasked security teams with finding exploits in competing solutions to try to destroy the reputation of anyone who could launch an effective competing store.

Re: A Post-Google World?

#15

Post by webstrand »

wiseowise wrote: post #10
SoftTalker wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't see how this is a problem. Back in the days when we used to buy software for PCs you could go pick up WordPerfect or Lotus or whatever at any number of bookstores, office supply stores, or mail order outlets. Fundamentally I see no problem with multiple app stores, it will be a boon for developers as the stores will have to compete over how much of a cut they take. Or developers can sell direct.

Android already has alternative app stores.

Nevertheless you can't install a Kindle app that you can actually buy books through: Google's monopoly has prevented this.

Re: A Post-Google World?

#17

Post by throwaway48540 »

wiseowise wrote: post #11
throwaway48540 wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Except for the Android users who actually tried not using Google Play and know it usually results in a "Play Services are required" error message.

An application written using Play Services requires Play Services - shocking.

Even applications not using any of these services often require it.

Re: A Post-Google World?

#18

Post by fallingknife »

kmeisthax wrote: post #13
wslh wrote: post #2

Before reading the article, I assumed it was about LLMs. It looks like the regulators have perfectly timed their focus on Google’s business. Is Microsoft laughing at this point?

Only in the narrow sense that Microsoft managed to avoid structural remedies due to Bush Jr. shenanigans that were forgotten because the case was settled three days before 9/11. In the broader sense they've got loads of consent decrees on them, first from the US, then from the EU. They can't even kick CrowdStrike out of the NT kernel! Even among big tech, Google is an unusually meaty target because: 1. Literally all…

Besides 3, what does any of this have to do with anti-trust law?

Re: A Post-Google World?

#19

Post by tmpz22 »

LegionMammal978 wrote: post #4

> At some point, they will give up and realize that the writing is on the wall for their current business model. I'd sooner think hell would freeze over than Google would ever 'give up' on its business model of its own accord. I can hardly imagine half of its services being viable as separate businesses. Which might well be a boon for competitors (especially in adtech), but not for any of Google's current employees o…

If profits degrade for Google society will feel the impact pretty quickly. Think about how many schools rely on Google for Education for email, SSO, and Chromebooks. Think about people who rely on Google Maps, Sheets, Docs, and other loss-leading products. Think about all the data they scoop up in all their apps.

Late game capitalism applied to Google's portfolio would be catastrophic.

Re: A Post-Google World?

#20

Post by wslh »

kmeisthax wrote: post #13
wslh wrote: post #2

Before reading the article, I assumed it was about LLMs. It looks like the regulators have perfectly timed their focus on Google’s business. Is Microsoft laughing at this point?

Only in the narrow sense that Microsoft managed to avoid structural remedies due to Bush Jr. shenanigans that were forgotten because the case was settled three days before 9/11. In the broader sense they've got loads of consent decrees on them, first from the US, then from the EU. They can't even kick CrowdStrike out of the NT kernel! Even among big tech, Google is an unusually meaty target because: 1. Literally all…

Regarding point 1, and in comparison to Microsoft, the company has historically acquired other businesses to fuel its growth (DOS, cough cough...). This is a normal playbook.
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