Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Why Don't Tech Companies Pay Their Engineers to Stay?

goethena.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

81–90 of 294 posts

Re: Why Don't Tech Companies Pay Their Engineers to Stay?

#81

Post by ryandrake »

kennyloginz wrote: post #64
ryandrake wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep, I look at every extra dollar I could make (that I don't technically need to survive) as some number fewer minutes until I can retire. So every extra dollar is worth it, no matter how frugal my lifestyle is.

Wow. Is this really true? Do you live in a studio apt in the Midwest while working for a FAANG?

I consider myself a "FIRE devotee without the compensation necessary to actually FIRE." So yea, time to retirement is definitely a variable that I actively try to minimize however I can. I don't want to be one of those guys who has to wait so long to retire that they're dead.

Re: Why Don't Tech Companies Pay Their Engineers to Stay?

#82

Post by nsxwolf »

steelframe wrote: post #25
BadHumans wrote: post #9

This entire piece starts from the conclusion that engineers leave because they aren't paid enough then works backwards from there. This is wrong from my experience. Anecdotally, I have never left a job because of money. Sure, I left jobs and got ones that ended up paying more money but the reason I started looking in the first place wasn't money. It was for other reasons that usually included frustrations with manage…

You should try leaving a company for money sometime. Financial independence really is life-changing, and you can get there surprisingly quickly in the tech industry by putting yourself on the market more often. Anecdotally, at my current company nearly everyone I know who left did so within a few months of hitting the 4-year cliff on their signing equity. I've left 3 companies in my career primarily because the next…

I always find my salary very difficult to replace, and it's not particularly high. I'm assuming it's all pay cuts from here on out with the economy the way it is.

Re: Why Don't Tech Companies Pay Their Engineers to Stay?

#83

Post by mixmastamyk »

jauntywundrkind wrote: post #60

With apologies, they are idiots. That they can't frelling figure out even remotely who is worthwhile to keep around or not is 300% on them, something so few orgs actually calibrate on, or do so based off awful anti-signals on, and it's embarrassing that this pathetic foolery has just gone on and on and on and on, with zero signs of improving. My boss loves me, swears I'm so full fo awesome knowledge & smarts. But eve…

Intelligence is not enough, one needs people skills as well. Dale Carnegie and Getting to Yes might help.

Re: Why Don't Tech Companies Pay Their Engineers to Stay?

#84

Post by dartos »

nsxwolf wrote: post #82
steelframe wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You should try leaving a company for money sometime. Financial independence really is life-changing, and you can get there surprisingly quickly in the tech industry by putting yourself on the market more often. Anecdotally, at my current company nearly everyone I know who left did so within a few months of hitting the 4-year cliff on their signing equity. I've left 3 companies in my career primarily because the next…

I always find my salary very difficult to replace, and it's not particularly high. I'm assuming it's all pay cuts from here on out with the economy the way it is.

For the next few years at least, probably

Re: Why Don't Tech Companies Pay Their Engineers to Stay?

#85

Post by Proziam »

lainga wrote: post #80
gregfjohnson wrote: post #78

A person close to me works at a law firm. She was feeling a bit stagnant, so she connected with a recruiter. She got a very solid offer with a significant pay bump. She gave her two weeks' notice to her firm, including appointments with the partners. One of the partners asked her for a half hour. They came back with a massive pay raise, and a promotion to partner if she would stay. She was in a state of shock, but th…

What prevents engineering firms from acting like law firms?

Management perceives people to be more replaceable than they are. Years of working in, or being the architect of, the company's core product will make you a true expert in it.

But, from the company perspective, your value is based on the 'market rate' for your generically defined skills and experience.

Re: Why Don't Tech Companies Pay Their Engineers to Stay?

#86

Post by ThrowawayR2 »

kulahan wrote: post #76
ryandrake wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep, I look at every extra dollar I could make (that I don't technically need to survive) as some number fewer minutes until I can retire. So every extra dollar is worth it, no matter how frugal my lifestyle is.

Here’s hoping you’re lucky enough to live until then. Don’t forget to live in the meantime. It’s a lot easier to hike across Europe in your 30s than in your 50s.

"Here’s hoping you’re lucky enough to live until then."? The median lifespan is over 80 and developers are paid above the median, often by quite a bit. It's far, far more likely in your 50s that you'll be staring down the barrel of a layoff + industry downturn and cursing yourself for the money spent on your trip across Europe and other frivolities in your 30s.

Re: Why Don't Tech Companies Pay Their Engineers to Stay?

#87

Post by 1oooqooq »

lainga wrote: post #80
gregfjohnson wrote: post #78

A person close to me works at a law firm. She was feeling a bit stagnant, so she connected with a recruiter. She got a very solid offer with a significant pay bump. She gave her two weeks' notice to her firm, including appointments with the partners. One of the partners asked her for a half hour. They came back with a massive pay raise, and a promotion to partner if she would stay. She was in a state of shock, but th…

What prevents engineering firms from acting like law firms?

engineers either have patent quotas or are blue collar as far as any Enterprise is concerned.

do you have patent quotas at your position? if not they are counting the days to replace you with a machine, someone overseas, a script, AI. depending on the decade.

Re: Why Don't Tech Companies Pay Their Engineers to Stay?

#88

Post by notepad0x90 »

dataflow wrote: post #68
notepad0x90 wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

HR has a saying "employees don't leave jobs, they leave managers". Pay has motivated me to look for other jobs, but only after I was already worn out and frustrated with my current job. Switching jobs isn't like getting a new car or moving to a new apartment. It's traumatic, kind of like going through a break-up. You work with the same people for years and then suddenly you will never see them again. That isn't pleas…

> HR has a saying "employees don't leave jobs, they leave managers". I'd say they leave people . The people aren't necessarily managers.

well, the thinking there is, managers manage people, so ultimately it is their failure to manage people that causes good performers to leave.

Re: Why Don't Tech Companies Pay Their Engineers to Stay?

#89

Post by dataflow »

notepad0x90 wrote: post #88
dataflow wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> HR has a saying "employees don't leave jobs, they leave managers". I'd say they leave people . The people aren't necessarily managers.

well, the thinking there is, managers manage people, so ultimately it is their failure to manage people that causes good performers to leave.

I mean, that thinking is obviously wrong. Not everything is within your manager's power to fix. And people have different tolerances with how many headaches they put up with too. The manager might need much more time to improve things than their employee might tolerate.

Re: Why Don't Tech Companies Pay Their Engineers to Stay?

#90

Post by BobbyTables2 »

BadHumans wrote: post #9

This entire piece starts from the conclusion that engineers leave because they aren't paid enough then works backwards from there. This is wrong from my experience. Anecdotally, I have never left a job because of money. Sure, I left jobs and got ones that ended up paying more money but the reason I started looking in the first place wasn't money. It was for other reasons that usually included frustrations with manage…

I find it pretty soul crushing to work hard and have a successful engineering team, only to have bonuses withheld because sales/marketing couldn’t hit lofty goals…

Followed by the company spending huge amounts of cash on acquisitions in the same year…

Too many companies are eager to invest in everything except their own employees.

Post reply on HN