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Company Says It Uses Your Phones Mic to Serve Ads for Facebook, Google, etc.

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Re: Company Says It Uses Your Phones Mic to Serve Ads for Facebook, Google, etc.

#41
post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> People have. And it's always shown that no apps are opening your mics when you're not using the app, and that if you're using the app they generally will only open your mic when it makes sense to do so. Can you link to people who have checked? I had a couple of the last BlackBerry phones, that ran Android. They came with this "DTEK" [1] app that monitored when apps accessed your phone's sensors. And I remember ever…

https://futurism.com/the-byte/phones-listen-theory-debunked https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CVazBWGgg64 They're sending pretty much everything BUT audio. Main reason is that audio is just tremendously inefficient compared to other signals. It's large and expensive to store and process and doesn't really give you that many bytes of information you can't get elsewhere for how expensive it is to handle.

That's not a very compelling experiment, compared to e.g. logging the actual traffic, core dumping the app, and decompiling the APK.

Could have a delay. Could only work when physically moving, indicating activity. Could only be activated for some user profiles based on usage patterns. Could only activate for device owner's voice, like the voice assistants.

I used to think audio would be prohibitively expensive for Facebook to eavesdrop. But they could easily sample at random, compute it on-device, then only send keyword hashes. I think it's much more technically feasible than you're giving it credit.

I agree they probably aren't. Most likely, they predict using their other spying, then people notice frequency illusion/coincidence. But I find it odd nobody's checked.

Re: Company Says It Uses Your Phones Mic to Serve Ads for Facebook, Google, etc.

#42
post #10

On Discord many years ago I spoke to someone about my "big belly". The next day I received ads about exactly that topic everywhere Adsense Facebook everywhere. So the technology is at least 10 years old and I totally believe that the story is true. The key issue here is that we don't own our phones. We have little control over what those apps do and often apps are hidden and can't be uninstalled.

I have noticed a similar trends, when speaking about some specific topics without following up on the device by traditional means (keyboard), ads started to show up in a day or to. Last occurrence, 6 months or so ago, of that happening was when one of my colleagues discussed vacation in a specific place I absolutely have no interest in visiting, so I was 100% sure I didn't google it or discussed it online. Surprising…

Could it be that they have the info of the holiday from your colleague. They then track the proximity between the two of you and then display you ads on things he is interested in.

You only notice these ads when it matches what you spoke about.

Re: Company Says It Uses Your Phones Mic to Serve Ads for Facebook, Google, etc.

#43
>Our technology […] collects opt-in customer behavior data from hundreds of popular websites that offer top display, video platforms, social applications, and mobile marketplaces that allow laser-focused media buying.

To me this seems:

1. not mobile specific; 2. totally plausible; 3. despicable in many ways, but “opt-in” makes me think of (a) masterfully crafted fine print in some Terms of Service that would acknowledge the collection of audio, and (b) that this has nothing to do with a phone mic maliciously being turned on without the user noticing, but it’s rather recording from a mic intentionally activated by the user during the normal interaction with an app or web site.

Re: Company Says It Uses Your Phones Mic to Serve Ads for Facebook, Google, etc.

#45
post #3

I am absolutely glad that, I disable Siri immediately on all of my devices and grateful for the ominous mic-in-use indicator on all apple devices. Android also has a mic in use indicator too, but own only a Pixel to comment on Android in general. The referenced articles are light on details and appear to be “he said she said they said” and pointing to the same archived blog post from CMG. That being said, I see a ris…

Samsung phones with android 14 do have the dot for the mic and camera usage, too

Re: Company Says It Uses Your Phones Mic to Serve Ads for Facebook, Google, etc.

#46

I'm a firm "ad audio spying denialist", but that's mainly an "uhm, ACKTUALLY" kind of denial. Ad firms absolutely do spy, but probably not through the use of microphone audio... mainly because that's way too much information for what they actually want to do. That and every mobile OS shows very obvious warnings whenever media capture is being used, and I'm not aware of a sanctioned way to defeat those that isn't a 0d…

>Ad firms absolutely do spy, but probably not through the use of microphone audio... mainly because that's way too much information

Ultrasonic tracking has been a thing for a long time

https://www.zdnet.com/article/hundreds-of-apps-are-using-ult...

Re: Company Says It Uses Your Phones Mic to Serve Ads for Facebook, Google, etc.

#47
post #16
post #6

I don’t see confirmation of anything in particular here, other than some ad sales company made some rather vague and dubious claims. Does anyone know what specifically they were talking about and if there’s anything to it?

From a Cox VP of Digital Strategy's blog post: "Our technology is on the cutting edge of voice data processing. We can identify buyers based on casual conversations in real time. It may seem like black magic, but it's not-it's AI. The growing ability to access microphone data on devices like smartphones and tablets enables our technology partner to aggregate and analyze voice data during pre-purchase conversations."…

If I had to guess, the partner mentioned here is likely a library provider used in those ad-laden mobile games that are advertised in other ad-laden mobile games. If this is actually happening, I think the overlap between people who'd notice what's happening and actually run these apps for a prolonged period is small to non existent.

Re: Company Says It Uses Your Phones Mic to Serve Ads for Facebook, Google, etc.

#48
post #10

On Discord many years ago I spoke to someone about my "big belly". The next day I received ads about exactly that topic everywhere Adsense Facebook everywhere. So the technology is at least 10 years old and I totally believe that the story is true. The key issue here is that we don't own our phones. We have little control over what those apps do and often apps are hidden and can't be uninstalled.

I have noticed a similar trends, when speaking about some specific topics without following up on the device by traditional means (keyboard), ads started to show up in a day or to. Last occurrence, 6 months or so ago, of that happening was when one of my colleagues discussed vacation in a specific place I absolutely have no interest in visiting, so I was 100% sure I didn't google it or discussed it online. Surprising…

If he googled it from the same network as you were on, then you could easily have been grouped together due to that.

Re: Company Says It Uses Your Phones Mic to Serve Ads for Facebook, Google, etc.

#49
post #3

I am absolutely glad that, I disable Siri immediately on all of my devices and grateful for the ominous mic-in-use indicator on all apple devices. Android also has a mic in use indicator too, but own only a Pixel to comment on Android in general. The referenced articles are light on details and appear to be “he said she said they said” and pointing to the same archived blog post from CMG. That being said, I see a ris…

Happy owner of several Samsung Note devices over the years. None have had a mic-in-use indicator.

Re: Company Says It Uses Your Phones Mic to Serve Ads for Facebook, Google, etc.

#50

I'm a firm "ad audio spying denialist", but that's mainly an "uhm, ACKTUALLY" kind of denial. Ad firms absolutely do spy, but probably not through the use of microphone audio... mainly because that's way too much information for what they actually want to do. That and every mobile OS shows very obvious warnings whenever media capture is being used, and I'm not aware of a sanctioned way to defeat those that isn't a 0d…

>Ad firms absolutely do spy, but probably not through the use of microphone audio... mainly because that's way too much information Ultrasonic tracking has been a thing for a long time https://www.zdnet.com/article/hundreds-of-apps-are-using-ult...

Yes but as a result of that coverage it's now very clear when apps use the microphone.

That pretty much killed this practice.

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