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Americans' love affair with big cars is killing them

economist.com

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Re: Americans' love affair with big cars is killing them

#311

Post by the_snooze »

xwall wrote: post #15

Key Ideas: Heavier vehicles are safer for their occupants but more dangerous for others: The weight of a vehicle is a critical factor in car crashes, with heavier vehicles causing more fatalities in other cars, pedestrians, and cyclists. The heaviest vehicles kill more people than they save: Analysis of crash data shows that for every life saved by the heaviest 1% of SUVs and trucks, more than a dozen lives are lost…

Despite how large vehicles are getting, people don't seem to want to have other passengers in them. Single-occupant vehicles account for something like 75% of daily commuters. Between safety concerns, sedentary lifestyles, road congestion, and the loneliness epidemic, you'd think there would be a push to reduce that number.

https://www2.census.gov/programs-surveys/commuting/guidance/...

Re: Americans' love affair with big cars is killing them

#312

Post by dham »

hmottestad wrote: post #53
OutOfHere wrote: post #39

It's not just the kill rate. It's also how much more toxic tire dust pollution the heavier vehicles put out.

Tires today contain a large amount of plastics. So what you are breathing while walking next to a road with a bunch of Teslas driving down it is basically a cloud of microplastics.

Tires are just one of the many things that have gone nowhere. There has to be a better way.

Re: Americans' love affair with big cars is killing them

#313

Post by Retric »

ncruces wrote: post #248
Retric wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn’t help that much. Each tire of a fully loaded 18 wheeler carries 4.4x the weight of a typical car tire. 4.4 ^ 4 = 378x the damage per tire but there are also 4.5x the tires so your at 1,700x the damage. That’s an oversimplification, but it doesn’t really matter if it’s 99.9% or 95% of the damage ware is still absolutely dominated by heavy vehicles.

And how many more SUVs go through that road? If there's a few hundred SUVs for every 18 wheeler, it's no longer negligible: it's 10 or 30% of the damage. And it could be a lot more negligible, if that mostly drive alone, drove a car with half the weight.

Most SUV’s aren’t that heavy.

I used 4,000lb for the car, a 2024 Chevrolet Suburban which is huge only clocks in at a 5,824 lbs. Load another 1,000lb for passengers etc and (6,824/4000) ^ 4 = 8.5x a car or 0.5% what I calculated for a full 18 wheeler.

Sure there’s more cars than 18 wheelers but 7,000lb is a rather extreme outlier in terms of SUV weight.

Re: Americans' love affair with big cars is killing them

#314

Post by dham »

seagullriffic wrote: post #62
xwall wrote: post #15

Key Ideas: Heavier vehicles are safer for their occupants but more dangerous for others: The weight of a vehicle is a critical factor in car crashes, with heavier vehicles causing more fatalities in other cars, pedestrians, and cyclists. The heaviest vehicles kill more people than they save: Analysis of crash data shows that for every life saved by the heaviest 1% of SUVs and trucks, more than a dozen lives are lost…

> The National Highway Traffic Safety Administration's rating system focuses on occupant safety, not the safety of other road users, and tax policies subsidize heavier vehicles. Sociopathic. Regulations and safety standards should be updated to consider both occupants' and others' safety. The auto manufacturers won't like this, because they are cheap and greedy.

Yeah, there is. It's called everyone having an automated driving system like FSD. The NHTSA is too concerned with me taking my eyes off the road for 2 seconds while FSD is enabled versus getting manufacturers to actually implement this stuff.

Why can I take my eyes off the road with FSD off and not with it on? They should mandate driver monitoring in every car when you're not driving with an autonomous system. As a motorcycle rider also, I'm telling you that everyone is literally on their phone when driving. I can see it all because I sit higher than everyone else. That's what the NHTSA should focus on.

Re: Americans' love affair with big cars is killing them

#315

Post by dham »

AstralJaeger wrote: post #181
creer wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They drive with a discipline / care that Americans refuse to even consider. Perhaps Americans should.

As someone who regularly drives on German highways, including the Autobahn, I may ad my two cents. While German drivers are often praised for their discipline, the reality I've observed, especially in unlimited speed sections of the Autobahn, can be quite different. Many drivers there seem to focus primarily on their perceived right to drive as fast as they want, often creating dangerous situations for others who may…

If you drove 150 MPH on an American road you would end up 100 yards into the woods flipping over 90 times, after hitting 1 of 65 potholes that are 4 feet deep on the interstate.

Re: Americans' love affair with big cars is killing them

#316

Post by dwattttt »

jl6 wrote: post #128
dataflow wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like this means taxes should be imposed on cars proportionally to the fourth power of axle load too.

The unintended consequences of this would be: Massive increase in the cost of public transport as buses pass their tax costs onto users. Massive increase in the cost of freight shipping, which would be passed on to consumers, i.e. everybody, since virtually every part of the economy depends indirectly on freight transport. It would amount to everybody paying, and thus being more or less equivalent to public funding o…

It's worth noting that unless the roads are degrading and not being repaired, those costs are already being paid. It's just a question of who is paying it.

Re: Americans' love affair with big cars is killing them

#317

Post by sidewndr46 »

PaulHoule wrote: post #3

I hate sounding like a broken record but my belief is that car makers are more excited about XXXXL cars in American than car buyers are. The media is consistently complicit in covering this up, sounding like the brainwashed soldiers in The Manchurian Candidate It's not to say that we don't like big cars because we do, but walk into a car dealership looking for a small car and they will tell you they are out of stock…

The profit margins don't exist on the small vehicle you're looking for. There is limited to no incentive to manufacture it

Re: Americans' love affair with big cars is killing them

#318

Post by snakeyjake »

tim333 wrote: post #301
snakeyjake wrote: post #262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They make all of the cars you want except for the electric Miata which would sell in such low quantities that it would have to be priced higher than the Taycan to be viable. Nobody's spending $180k on a Mazda. You just don't want them. I have a Fiat Spider for fun, and a Volvo V60 wagon for utility. My wife is 5'3" and is taller, barely, than the V60. The Spider is dead and the Miata is dying because global sales hav…

The original Tesla roadster of the type orbiting near Mars was basically an electric Miata. I guess they didn't sell enough although the price was a lot less than $180k.

The o.g. Tesla roadster was $100k and Tesla lost money on each one.

Also, it was not a good car.

$100k in 2008 is $150k today.

I amend my estimate to be $150k.

Nobody’s paying $150k for a Mazda.

The new Tesla roadster is expected to start at $200k.

Re: Americans' love affair with big cars is killing them

#319

Post by dgfitz »

jeffbee wrote: post #200
dgfitz wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> People should be walking or cycling around town. This. Is a very out of touch opinion. I could write 20 paragraphs disagreeing, but I doubt it is worth my time to write or anyone else’s to read. Not every person is able-bodied enough to walk and bike. Also, people happen to need to get from A to B when it is cold, dark, raining, extremely hot, snowing, or just some kind of shitty outside. People need to drive to a…

> Not every person is able-bodied enough to walk and bike This is true, but it also true that not every person is able to drive a car. In fact the inability to drive is way more common than the inability to walk.

And the ability to be driven somewhere is ubiquitous. Cars can hold more than one person, generally.

Re: Americans' love affair with big cars is killing them

#320

Post by dgfitz »

PsylentKnight wrote: post #255
dgfitz wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> People should be walking or cycling around town. This. Is a very out of touch opinion. I could write 20 paragraphs disagreeing, but I doubt it is worth my time to write or anyone else’s to read. Not every person is able-bodied enough to walk and bike. Also, people happen to need to get from A to B when it is cold, dark, raining, extremely hot, snowing, or just some kind of shitty outside. People need to drive to a…

You really think it's not possible to buy food without a car? Classic American, claiming X thing is an impossible pie-in-the-sky dream when there are loads of other countries that do X thing just fine.

I had groceries delivered today actually… a car drove them from the store to my home. What the fuck are you on about?
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