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Did your car witness a crime? Bay Area police may be coming for your Tesla

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Re: Did your car witness a crime? Bay Area police may be coming for your Tesla

#531

Post by iwishiknewlisp »

yuliyp wrote: post #314
Wytwwww wrote: post #253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right.. except the whole "argument" falls apart if we consider liability insurance. You can't force other people to have an extra $30k "just in case".

The point of mandated auto insurance is that a lot of people don't have an extra 30k, but we want even those without that extra 30k to be able to drive without those they might get into an accident with having their car damaged through no fault of their own and no way to get back the money from the person who caused it.

Makes no sense. Just have a better court system that makes people who cause damages to other's car have to pay a certain amount to that person per month. Like car insurance but there isn't a middle man and you only pay when you get in an accident.

Re: Did your car witness a crime? Bay Area police may be coming for your Tesla

#532

Post by iwishiknewlisp »

ryandrake wrote: post #198
iwishiknewlisp wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Around 10-30% of drivers in the United States don't have car insurance depending on the state. It really depends on the state on how strict they are with car insurance. My state is very lax and they don't even really check at the DMV. The fine for not having car insurance is also only ~300 bucks and a 90 day license suspension and it only goes up slightly until like the 4-5 time you get caught. It just honestly doesn…

It's shocking how many people are uninsured or underinsured. Plus, insurance minimums are absolutely ridiculous. Florida's minimum is $10K property damage, $10K personal injury, and they don't even require bodily injury liability. Total insanity. You crash into a Porsche full of doctors with that kind of coverage, and you're going bankrupt. Most states have a minimum of around $25K for bodily injury liability. You ca…

> You can't even step foot into a hospital without paying $20K

I had a surgery and was in the hospital for a week. The out of pocket cost without insurance was lile 20-30 thousand if I remember correctly. And that is without coupons discount you usually get from cash payment. I used insurance, so I don't know what the discount wiuld be, but usually its like at least 10-20%.

I don't know what hospitals you got to, but 20K for a hospital visit is something I have never heard of.

Re: Did your car witness a crime? Bay Area police may be coming for your Tesla

#533

Post by rblatz »

vineyardmike wrote: post #417
rblatz wrote: post #306

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think this plays out where it becomes a luxury to drive oneself. Over the next 10-15 years it looks like self driving will continue to advance and will likely become safer than the alternative. Once that happens insurance companies will start charging more for people that drive themselves compared to people that let the car drive. I can see some states outlawing that practice. Then it’s left to see who is still und…

> I think this plays out where it becomes a luxury to drive oneself. Over the next 10-15 years it looks like self driving will continue to advance and will likely become safer than the alternative. I think this is a long way away and will vary geographically. For a long time, self driving cars will be more expensive because they’ll have expensive sensors on it. Not many people will want a $100K self driving car inste…

Tesla Model 3 is right below that $30,000 mark, Tesla FSD does the bulk of my driving today. I think your core premise is flawed, it will be cheaper and sooner than you anticipate which will alter the conclusions you’ve come to.

Re: Did your car witness a crime? Bay Area police may be coming for your Tesla

#534

Post by throwaway48476 »

rblatz wrote: post #533
vineyardmike wrote: post #417

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I think this plays out where it becomes a luxury to drive oneself. Over the next 10-15 years it looks like self driving will continue to advance and will likely become safer than the alternative. I think this is a long way away and will vary geographically. For a long time, self driving cars will be more expensive because they’ll have expensive sensors on it. Not many people will want a $100K self driving car inste…

Tesla Model 3 is right below that $30,000 mark, Tesla FSD does the bulk of my driving today. I think your core premise is flawed, it will be cheaper and sooner than you anticipate which will alter the conclusions you’ve come to.

Teslas 'FSD' is not the commonly understood HOOTL self driving.

Re: Did your car witness a crime? Bay Area police may be coming for your Tesla

#535

Post by throwaway48476 »

sokoloff wrote: post #489
adrianN wrote: post #429

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn’t be surprised if safety requirements will gradually tighten until every car will need most sensors. Manufacturers have an interest in selling expensive difficult to manufacture cars and politicians like to reduce traffic fatalities.

The average age of a car in the US is 12.6 years old right now. History shows that we’ve not forced safety items into existing cars. (I have one car where I would be permitted to pass safety inspection without seat belts (any) because it wasn’t originally equipped. [I have chosen to add them.])

12.6 and rising.

Re: Did your car witness a crime? Bay Area police may be coming for your Tesla

#536

Post by throwaway48476 »

pmichaud wrote: post #152
rbalicki wrote: post #6

Genuine question: What is stopping some small percent of drivers from installing cameras and using ML to identify cars driving dangerously (e.g. speeding, running reds, changing multiple lanes at once, etc.), and when their license plate is identifiable, finding and informing their insurance company? If even a small subset of users did this, and insurers did something with this information, it would substantially dis…

Setting aside the obvious dystopian next steps, I think the main problem with automated traffic law enforcement is that our laws are quite bad in the sense that they rely on enforcement being loose and somewhat subjective to even work at all. The speeds on various roads, the timing of traffic lights, the places one can park and for how long, etc, are not carefully planned or thought out enough to actually work if eve…

Often when they are meticulously designed it is for revenue generation and not safety.

Re: Did your car witness a crime? Bay Area police may be coming for your Tesla

#537

Post by iwishiknewlisp »

Wytwwww wrote: post #253
iwishiknewlisp wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Around 10-30% of drivers in the United States don't have car insurance depending on the state. It really depends on the state on how strict they are with car insurance. My state is very lax and they don't even really check at the DMV. The fine for not having car insurance is also only ~300 bucks and a 90 day license suspension and it only goes up slightly until like the 4-5 time you get caught. It just honestly doesn…

Right.. except the whole "argument" falls apart if we consider liability insurance. You can't force other people to have an extra $30k "just in case".

No, just make them pay out 30k in installments if they arw liable for something.

Or take them to court. The average person will lose hundreds of thousands of dollars in their lifetime from required insurance for all type of dumb things.

We need the government to force everyone to pay an organization that does nothing but hold money in case of accidents and then release it back. We need this because people are too cowardly and fearful, so they accept financial sodomy in exchange for a very small piece of mind.

If we are going to force insuramce on people, why not just go all the way and start forcing people to not eat junky food. It costs the us citizen way more to pay for the obese and unhealthy than anywhere close to the average american will pay for an accident without insuramce. Might as well start restricting all freedoms. Take my money take my freedom, here let me bend over. That is all of you. Paying 30-50% i taxes to the government accepting that they can force you to buy a service i.e. health insurance, car insurance.

Weak people vote for more government control, because thwy are cowardly rats. They desire being controlled, read anti-oedipus and you'll understand that your little brain enslaves itself in a false prison. The mind of weak disgusting borderline subspecies humans have formed a societal prison, where freedom doesn't exist. And the strong non mentally ill are forced to accept this prison or will be insulted saying "they don't common sense" or "aren't practical".

Enough talk, the fact that a lesser human like you actually gets to determine how I live my life is disgusting. The wardens of the prison are everyday "people" who should be culled like cattle. I don't dislike the system, because its an illusion. The system is just a bunch of lesser humans who have drank the koolaid, you don't drink it and they will call you crazy. Reminds me of how Uncle Ted fought against the prison after escaping from the mind control of mass psychosis, so we locked him up. I wish with all my heart God exists, so when all you die you are judged and you have your face smashed into reality and truth at a million miles per second. The few sane are forced to fit in the sea of the mental midgets, who exist not ambivalent to slavery, but as its enablers.

Re: Did your car witness a crime? Bay Area police may be coming for your Tesla

#538

Post by hansvm »

kelnos wrote: post #451
hansvm wrote: post #445

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That isn't a political statement. The flow from "we won't shove you in a database" to "the non-existent database was leaked" is something that's independently verifiable. > left/right Yes, many people care about freedom > going to have a hard time accepting self-driving cars I'm usually optimistic, but I don't think public sentiment matters here. To the extent it does, it'll be some sort of Faustian bargain, where th…

I'll certainly accept the possibility of bugs allowing remote takeover of vehicle cameras, but in general I don't think rear cameras are much of a risk to privacy. They're not always-on (generally they only turn on when the car is in reverse gear), and on many car models they're even physically covered when they're not active. (E.g. on my car, the manufacturer logo on the rear of the car flips up to allow the rear ca…

My complaint (from above, not the only problem with cameras) about the rear camera is that the cheapest way for them to be installed nowadays, given that other people want infotainment systems, is for them to go hand-in-hand with an infotainment system. Whether the camera is on or not, the car is now vulnerable.

The sin being committed is having too much code, especially too much untrusted, untested code (it's "just a radio") wired into the canbus. Toss in a little auto-update functionality and some always-on antennas, and you have all the makings of a nasty exploit. Last I checked, none of those have been known to be exploited in the wild, but they've also not been patched in the last decade. It's a fundamental design flaw that saves a few dollars, so it persists.

Re: Did your car witness a crime? Bay Area police may be coming for your Tesla

#539

Post by throwaway48476 »

kelnos wrote: post #454
Corrado wrote: post #446

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was just discussing this with my wife while driving on the local expressway on a clear Saturday afternoon. The speed limit is 55 MPH but everyone was moving at 70 MPH without any issues. The road is wide and straight with limited on/off ramps and the faster speed felt very natural. This is a common occurrence on this road and everyone seems to abide pretty well. Sure, there is the occasional "idiot" doing stupid th…

The problem with speed limits in general is that they're not universally applicable. Darkness, fog, rain, snow, etc. can all change what the actual safe maximum speed is. So even with a posted 55mph speed limit, the maximum safe speed at a particular time might be lower (even considerably lower), and a LEO could cite you for going too fast even if you're driving under the posted limit. (I've been on the interstate in…

A lot of departments have policies about not interrupting thr normal flow of traffic.

Re: Did your car witness a crime? Bay Area police may be coming for your Tesla

#540

Post by rblatz »

bamboozled wrote: post #370
rblatz wrote: post #306

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think this plays out where it becomes a luxury to drive oneself. Over the next 10-15 years it looks like self driving will continue to advance and will likely become safer than the alternative. Once that happens insurance companies will start charging more for people that drive themselves compared to people that let the car drive. I can see some states outlawing that practice. Then it’s left to see who is still und…

Won't happen unless tradesmen, engineers, etc can use self-driving cars, which will e awkward when you need to park up onto a curb or something to inspect a downed power line.

That is what .5% of all drivers that need to drive on a curb to inspect a power line? I’m not sure what your point even is here?
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