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Microsoft introduces Windows Phone 8

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Re: Microsoft introduces Windows Phone 8

#181

Post by KeyBoardG »

onetwothreefour wrote: post #177
KeyBoardG wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lumia will get WinPhone 7.8 which includes all the UI updates but leaves out the features which requires more advanced hardware.

LOL. Native languages do not "require more advanced hardware", since you can already use native languages on iOS and Android hardware. Are you people brainwashed? WP7 is dead.

The native APIs and all that support work is built into the updated kernel... That is the point. Don't be so quick to point out superficial faults on internet comments.

Re: Microsoft introduces Windows Phone 8

#182

Post by duaneb »

RyanMcGreal wrote: post #116
desigooner wrote: post #30

I get a chuckle out of reading people's views w.r.t. Microsoft. There are a good number who complain about lack of innovation & how Microsoft invests too much time in supporting legacy systems and that they should totally get rid of the CE core. Then there's the other end of the spectrum where Microsoft is stupid to stop supporting certain platforms because they're clearly not thinking about the users who use those s…

Joel Spolsky famously wrote about those competing imperatives in a 2004 essay on the API war: http://www.joelonsoftware.com/articles/APIWar.html "There are two opposing forces inside Microsoft, which I will refer to, somewhat tongue-in-cheek, as The Raymond Chen Camp and The MSDN Magazine Camp." The former is obsessed with backwards compatibility, and the latter is obsessed with the Next New Thing. Spolsky's thesis w…

That's funny - my hatred of Windows almost entirely boils down to their reluctance to chuck old and horrible APIs (see windows.h). I'm not sure how much this is true anymore.

Re: Microsoft introduces Windows Phone 8

#183

Post by wavephorm »

huggyface wrote: post #180
wavephorm wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you really imagine that the hundreds of millions of Android users chose "anything but Apple"? Yes I believe this is true. There are very few redeeming qualities that an Android tablet has over an iPad. Likewise the people I know with Android phones either couldn't afford an iPhone, don't want one due to philosophical issues, or just wanted a simple feature-less cell phone and an Android phone was the same price. P…

You clearly exist within an Apple fan bubble. Your opinion has zero correlation with reality and you didn't even understand the point I was making. Rather I would say that you couldn't understand it.

Excuse me, but "reality" is the world around you. My "opinion" is based on my own experiences, and my own observations of the people I know -- because that's what reality is. Reality is not simply what "people say" on internet tech websites and android discussion forums.

Re: Microsoft introduces Windows Phone 8

#184

Post by freehunter »

onetwothreefour wrote: post #176
freehunter wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's ignoring the long history of Windows Mobile from 2002 to 2010 though.

That history is irrelevant since we're talking about Windows Phone and not Windows Mobile. Did HN get over-run by MS employees or something? What the hell is going on! :)

I believe the original statement was "Windows on a phone". If Windows Mobile (Windows CE) doesn't count, Windows Phone 7 (also Windows CE) doesn't either. Windows Mobile 6.1 through 6.5 was actually branded Windows Phone.

Maybe people are just realizing that the Microsoft of the Xbox era isn't the same as the Microsoft of the Windows 9x era and the grass isn't always greener on the Apple side. Maybe people are just sick of hearing the same anti-Microsoft circlejerk and facts-be-damned arguments. Hell, I'm a Linux user and I get pissed. Even when MS comes out with a good, competitive product, the Internet cries "failure!" before it's even released. "Why doesn't Microsoft just copy Apple?" "OMG Microsoft just copied Apple!"

For the record, I felt the same way when the Internet started bashing on ChromeOS and the iPad before giving it a chance.

Re: Microsoft introduces Windows Phone 8

#185

Post by sjwright »

powertower wrote: post #108
sjwright wrote: post #43

When Steve Jobs returned to Apple, he made it really clear that Apple's job wasn't to beat Microsoft. Apple then delivered on that assessment and created entirely new markets for themselves. Sadly, somehow, Microsoft went all XOR on our asses. I'm still baffled about how Microsoft is still trying to out-Apple Apple when they've repeatedly proven it's a disastrous strategy (see: Zune). Microsoft are kings of productiv…

> when they've repeatedly proven it's a disastrous strategy (see: Zune). That's not the best example to use of Microsoft's failure. Every time Zune has been brought up for discussion here, I've seen primarily two types of responses... From people that actually owned a Zune: Fantastic product (better than my Apple iPod) . From people that never owned or tried a Zune: It's absolute crap (I've never seen any of my iPod…

I'm sure the Zune was a fantabulous product. It was still an utterly failed strategy, because by that point, the game wasn't a competition about how nice to use the product was.

The same is true for phones today.

Re: Microsoft introduces Windows Phone 8

#186

Post by sjwright »

huggyface wrote: post #136
drzaiusapelord wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

MS isn't going after Apple. It probably can't, but it knows that if it delivers tablets and phones that can integrate with AD, Exchange, and other enterprise services and be a lot less locked down, they can steal Android's lunch and create a business friendly phone/tablet ecosystem. If Joe and Jane Public buy those, that's great too. Oh, and they will because they'll feel comfortable with Windows, especially if they…

MS isn't going after Apple. Microsoft is absolutely going after Apple. Apple is making inroads into business -- and with that influence and control over enterprise choices -- and Microsoft rightly sees the threat. On the Venn diagram of needs that a device satisfies, WP7 and now 8 overlaps the iPhone far more than it overlaps Android. Oh, and they will because they'll feel comfortable with Windows, especially if they…

Trying to beat RIM is obviously a bad move, but there's still billions of dollars to be made on phones that businesses deploy to their employees.

Extensive remote control, feature-by-feature lock-down, active directory style roaming profiles, super-hardened security, VoIP-over-VPN phone calls... the list of possibilities goes on. Get this right, and every company on the planet with any sense of paranoia will be theirs for the taking.

Re: Microsoft introduces Windows Phone 8

#187

Post by sjwright »

decode wrote: post #109
sjwright wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Are you forgetting that they're also still king of the consumer desktop? They're probably still the majority shareholder, but I wouldn't call them kings. And if they are kings, they're leading a dying kingdom. Have you seen the iPad sales numbers recently?

> And if they are kings, they're leading a dying kingdom. Have you seen the iPad sales numbers recently? Here are the Q1 2012 numbers: PC sales [1]: 88.9 million iPad sales [2]: 11.8 million About 13% as many iPad sales as PC sales. While the iPad sales are impressive, it doesn't seem like PCs are dying yet. [1] http://www.gartner.com/it/page.jsp?id=1981717 [2] http://www.abiresearch.com/press/3919

How many of those PCs were sold to homes?

Re: Microsoft introduces Windows Phone 8

#188

Post by islisis »

RobAtticus wrote: post #84
WrkInProgress wrote: post #80

Whenever MS does one of these presentations, they always seem to get 90% of the way there in terms of polish, focus and message. Why are they even bothering with branding "Windows Phone 7.8" ? They should have just named the update "Windows Phone 8 Legacy" and the actual WP 8, "Windows Phone 8".

Might just me, but I prefer "Windows Phone 7.8" vs "Windows Phone 8 Legacy". It's shorter, and when given a short explanation I get what it is. If you call it "Windows Phone 8 Legacy" people are going to wonder why they can't install WP8 apps on it, after all, it has WP8 in the name. Edit: forgot the word "apps"

The correct name is "Windows Phone ME"

Re: Microsoft introduces Windows Phone 8

#189

Post by rahoulb »

decode wrote: post #109
sjwright wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Are you forgetting that they're also still king of the consumer desktop? They're probably still the majority shareholder, but I wouldn't call them kings. And if they are kings, they're leading a dying kingdom. Have you seen the iPad sales numbers recently?

> And if they are kings, they're leading a dying kingdom. Have you seen the iPad sales numbers recently? Here are the Q1 2012 numbers: PC sales [1]: 88.9 million iPad sales [2]: 11.8 million About 13% as many iPad sales as PC sales. While the iPad sales are impressive, it doesn't seem like PCs are dying yet. [1] http://www.gartner.com/it/page.jsp?id=1981717 [2] http://www.abiresearch.com/press/3919

From a 0% to 13% in just 2 years sounds pretty good to me.

Re: Microsoft introduces Windows Phone 8

#190

Post by snaky »

runjake wrote: post #65
sjwright wrote: post #43

When Steve Jobs returned to Apple, he made it really clear that Apple's job wasn't to beat Microsoft. Apple then delivered on that assessment and created entirely new markets for themselves. Sadly, somehow, Microsoft went all XOR on our asses. I'm still baffled about how Microsoft is still trying to out-Apple Apple when they've repeatedly proven it's a disastrous strategy (see: Zune). Microsoft are kings of productiv…

> Something that competes with Blackberry? The BlackBerry is pretty much dead. This is now largely the iPhone's market (being the only modern smartphone platform with completely solid Exchange support ), so Microsoft is back to competing with Apple again. Android has some level of Exchange support, as well. But what that entails depends on the OEM and their modifications (eg. Exchange support on an HTC Android device…

Hmm. Is current state of Exchange support in WP7 really worse than in iOS? Just asking, if someone did any comparition.
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