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Telegram founder charged with wide range of crimes in France

nytimes.com

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Re: Telegram founder charged with wide range of crimes in France

#31
post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah and Telegram is also the biggest source of disinfo. Total Russian operation.

Sorry but you can't blame the medium for this. If you do please also blame everybody else: keyboard producers, monitor manufacturers etc. Do not just cherry pick one vendor.

This is like saying there is no difference between a postal worker and the getaway driver in a bank heist.

Re: Telegram founder charged with wide range of crimes in France

#32
post #28
post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting that this comment is down-voted. I think it's worth noting that Telegram LLC—as organisation itself—is anomalous to the point where it's consistent with Russian "cover" doctrine. For example, you wouldn't find ex-Telegram employees on Linkedin, Telegram itself seemingly doesn't invite people for interviews, there's no ex-Telegram people in the industry. Their open source software is developed using fake-u…

> Telegram doesn't seem to compete for engineering talent on labour market, Telegram employees don't go to conferences, are never seen on mailing lists of open source projects, etc. Isn't the whole narrative that Durov, who is essentially extremely rich as a result of building VK, bankrolled the whole creation? For all of the criticism, Telegram remains one of the most highly polished and well-designed apps I've ever…

> Maybe they don't need to compete on talent simply because they're paid well by Durov?

Or because they're staffed by the Kremlin!

Re: Telegram founder charged with wide range of crimes in France

#33

If Durov is liable for crimes committed on his platform how far away are we from making phone companies and ISPs liable for crimes committed using their services? This is a very slippery slope. I don't see a problem with requiring a company to cooperate with a court order to release data. However if a company does not have this data (because it's encrypted) it should not be liable or be required to collect such data.

Agreed. But Telegram seems to have this data unencrypted.

Re: Telegram founder charged with wide range of crimes in France

#34

If Durov is liable for crimes committed on his platform how far away are we from making phone companies and ISPs liable for crimes committed using their services? This is a very slippery slope. I don't see a problem with requiring a company to cooperate with a court order to release data. However if a company does not have this data (because it's encrypted) it should not be liable or be required to collect such data.

but that's exactly what's happening. They have the data and they don't comply. Phone companies and ISPs get court-ordered to release data all the time and they do it or go to jail too

Re: Telegram founder charged with wide range of crimes in France

#35
post #15

It is even possible that Durov has saved lives by not communicating user information to the french intelligence services. Recently have been a bunch of scandals where french intelligence officers where involved in murder plots. - There is "Haurus", a french intelligence officer who sold personal information on the darknet, in one case he sold personal information including the address of a drug dealer. Something that…

To make things even stranger, Durov was apparently invited to lunch by Macron. Instead of a presidential welcome, he was arrested on arrival.

Source: https://x.com/Zlatti_71/status/1828529272539304278

Re: Telegram founder charged with wide range of crimes in France

#36

Some interesting facts: - Durov is, according to him, living in exile outside of Russia since 2014 - due to Russian gov persecution. - Since his "exile" - he has travelled 50-60 times to Russia https://www.reddit.com/r/Telegram/comments/1f2pgg3/pavel_dur... - Most Russian billionaires that live in exile and are persecuted by the RU gov fall from windows (or something tall) quite often. Durov has been living lavishly…

He also has a French citizenship despite having no connections to France, which he somehow magically gotten due to "merit foreigner" status in 2021.

Le Monde couldn't figure out why he gotten that citizenship, there is very little detail.

>Durov was naturalized as a French citizen in August 2021, giving him European Union citizenship. Le Monde described the naturalisation as "mysterious", since Durov had not resided in France apart from brief visits. Le Monde suggested that Durov was naturalised via the rarely used "merit foreigner" procedure that is awarded directly by the French government to people viewed to have contributed exceptionally to France's international influence or international economic relations.

Re: Telegram founder charged with wide range of crimes in France

#37

If Durov is liable for crimes committed on his platform how far away are we from making phone companies and ISPs liable for crimes committed using their services? This is a very slippery slope. I don't see a problem with requiring a company to cooperate with a court order to release data. However if a company does not have this data (because it's encrypted) it should not be liable or be required to collect such data.

>how far away are we from making phone companies and ISPs liable for crimes committed using their services?

They are already liable unless they follow the law to enjoy certain exemptions.

Re: Telegram founder charged with wide range of crimes in France

#38
post #15

It is even possible that Durov has saved lives by not communicating user information to the french intelligence services. Recently have been a bunch of scandals where french intelligence officers where involved in murder plots. - There is "Haurus", a french intelligence officer who sold personal information on the darknet, in one case he sold personal information including the address of a drug dealer. Something that…

> It is even possible that Durov has saved lives by not communicating user information to the french intelligence services.

If you ignore the missing human rights activists were using telegram and then suddenly disappeared.

as pointed out before, telegram is utterly compromised security wise. Its really advantageous that "naughty people" are documenting their stuff there as it leaves a loverly indelible trail of actions.

Re: Telegram founder charged with wide range of crimes in France

#39
I’m disappointed to see how few people are up to date on what legal responsibilities platform hosts have.

Didn’t we have months and months of this discussion around the last US presidential election? Haven’t we had this discussion years ago when piracy was rampant on ”surface web” sites?

Businesses have always had legal requirements based on the nature of their trade.

Re: Telegram founder charged with wide range of crimes in France

#40
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One person's 'disinfo' is another's info, that same person's info is propaganda to another. The recent acknowledgement by Zuckerberg that the Biden/Harris regime pressured them into censoring information should give you some thought about what is 'disinfo'. In other words don't be too quick in condemning channels which allow voices outside the desired narrative to be heard because the day might come than you need to…

> One person's 'disinfo' is another's info, that same person's info is propaganda to another Yeah the only difference is that one person is right and the other person is wrong. > The recent acknowledgement by Zuckerberg that the Biden/Harris regime pressured them into censoring information should give you some thought about what is 'disinfo'. Of course they fucking did, and so they should have. Also, you think the cu…

>why do you think there's no anti-anaesthetics movement?

for one, I've never been required to get anesthesia as a condition of employment. lumping all vaccines together is not productive and we don't do that when discussing painkillers. there is a movement against OxyContin but not a movement against Ibuprofen.

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