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Is 'No tax on tips' a distraction from the fight to end sub-minimum wages?

theguardian.com

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Re: Is 'No tax on tips' a distraction from the fight to end sub-minimum wages?

#121

Post by golergka »

FigurativeVoid wrote: post #38
afavour wrote: post #17

IMO it's just bad policy all round without a significantly higher level of detail. For example, how do we classify a tip vs a wage? If we're not very, very specific about it's going to be yet another tax loophole exploited by the rich who will pay each other $1 for work and then 'tip' thousands more. Sure you’re an engineer on staff now but wouldn’t you want to be a freelancer, paid minimum wage and then a healthy “t…

I would say this is ridiculous, until I read Snyder v. United States[1,2]. > Held: Section 666 proscribes bribes to state and local officials but does not make it a crime for those officials to accept gratuities for their past acts. Pp. 7–16. 1. https://www.supremecourt.gov/opinions/23pdf/23-108_8n5a.pdf . 2. https://www.scotusblog.com/case-files/cases/snyder-v-united-...

I think a difference between a bribe and gratitude is pretty obvious. If the official had prior knowledge that he would receive an award, its a bribe. If he had no reason to expect it before making a decision, it's gratitude.

Re: Is 'No tax on tips' a distraction from the fight to end sub-minimum wages?

#122

Post by jen20 »

maximinus_thrax wrote: post #49
throw_m239339 wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In some cultures, people "tip" teachers, police officers, doctors, politicians, judges... you know where I'm going with that... I'm not saying tips should be banned but there certainly is a "cultural aspect" to tipping...

No, they don't. You're trying a false equivalency between a bribe and gratuity. A bribe happens before the service is provided and the service is contingent upon the bribe. Gratuity is post factum, technically based on the quality of the service provided.

> Gratuity is post factum, technically based on the quality of the service provided.

Based on this, almost everyone using a Stripe/Toast/whatever terminal is accepting a bribe, not a tip.

Re: Is 'No tax on tips' a distraction from the fight to end sub-minimum wages?

#123

Post by loa_in_ »

diob wrote: post #39
bko wrote: post #12

I don't like tipping culture, but it does allow for wealthy people to subsidize service and incentivizes good service. People that are more price sensitive tip lower and every once in a while a waiter will experience an extremely generous tip. I'm not convinced that forbidding tips would increase net wages paid to servers. In terms of who is paying, restaurants will simply raise prices to account for higher wages. Th…

I've actually gotten much better service in places like Australia / Japan where tips aren't a thing. From my understanding, poor people are often the best tippers in the USA, and rich folks tend to not tip.

Statistically speaking, really rich people never cross paths with most establishments

Re: Is 'No tax on tips' a distraction from the fight to end sub-minimum wages?

#124

Post by jerlam »

bcrosby95 wrote: post #32

I dislike this proposal. Just like I'm not a fan of $20/hour minimum wage for fast food in California. I don't see why we should hold service workers that get tips, and in California's case, those that work at fast food, above other wage earners. It feels degenerate that the government is signalling to us that we should e.g. work in fast food and as a waiter over preschools and child care.

Especially in states like California, where there is no separate lower tipped wage for anyone.

Re: Is 'No tax on tips' a distraction from the fight to end sub-minimum wages?

#125

Post by lcnPylGDnU4H9OF »

hoosieree wrote: post #42
flerchin wrote: post #3

It needs to be clear if I'm shafting a sub-minimum wage worker, or declining an egregious tip-ask at the self-check counter.

If you must tip, only ever use cash. Otherwise you're also subsidizing Square, Toast, Visa, Stripe, etc. Did they give you exceptional service today? Use cash.

Not that I disagree with this point but I'd say the best reason to choose cash would be that you can control who receives it. Give it directly to the person who provided the service you're tipping for, whenever possible.

Re: Is 'No tax on tips' a distraction from the fight to end sub-minimum wages?

#126

Post by brodouevencode »

mlyle wrote: post #116
brodouevencode wrote: post #70

It seems like a distraction. I had a uncle that would tell the wait staff that the cash he handed them was a gift and not a tip (with a wink and a nod).

Haha. Your uncle probably had waitstaff that did not understand that he was talking about a tax distinction and thought he was creepy. :P

He would only eat at the Waffle House near where he lived. They got it after a while.

Re: Is 'No tax on tips' a distraction from the fight to end sub-minimum wages?

#127

Post by fourteenfour »

princevegeta89 wrote: post #52
websap wrote: post #47

We're moving to a world that most restaurants won't have servers taking your food and drinks order. This is already happening in Seattle, multiple spots are now counter style ordering, you order, get a number and someone just comes from the kitchen to deliver the food. Some of them also have a QR code associated with your number which you can scan to order follow up items. Tipping more than 10% for counter style orde…

If you ask me, tipping more than 0% for counter style ordering where there is no dedicated waiter involved makes no sense. Even worse are the coffee shops - if you think getting a coffee is just a few bucks and is relatively cheap, note that you get robbed when you end up tipping. $1 or more tip on a $5 coffee. And there is nothing special you get, the baristas are just doing their basic job. Also the looks you get w…

$1 tip per prepared drink seems OK, tipping bartenders a similar amount is pretty standard.

Re: Is 'No tax on tips' a distraction from the fight to end sub-minimum wages?

#128

Post by [deleted] »

maerF0x0 wrote: post #54

IMO there should be a CoL adjusted minimum livable wage across the country, and it should be illegal to pay a >18 year old less than what it takes to live on. And that should be calculated from the barest minimum living standards[1]. At a certain point it becomes unconscionable for a wealthy society not to provide pure commodities at their lowest cost of delivery to it's poorest. As we do that, tips should be elimina…

[deleted]

Re: Is 'No tax on tips' a distraction from the fight to end sub-minimum wages?

#129

Post by gs17 »

HarHarVeryFunny wrote: post #94

The tipping culture in the US has got totally out of control over last 3-4 years. I'm more than fine tipping low waged people who provide an actual service like wait staff and barbers, but the ubiquitous payment terminals taking over for credit card payment, where the cashier/counter staff expect a 10/15/20% or more tip (some now have 20% as the minimum, unless you go "custom") for doing nothing, piss me off! What ne…

I've seen it at self-checkouts. Are you tipping based on how well you scanned things yourself?

Re: Is 'No tax on tips' a distraction from the fight to end sub-minimum wages?

#130

Post by nerdjon »

I am honestly curious who was really pushing this? Unless I missed it I don't think I heard anything about no taxes on tips until both candidates suddenly supported it. So just seems like it came out of nowhere.

If we really are going to stick with tips, I think it's fine. Maybe it will fix some of the issues on the workers side temporarily.

But we honestly just need to move away from tipping in the US. Give everyone a livable wage and increase prices slightly. I am already paying 15/20% more thanks to tipping so there is no harm in just increasing the cost of the item, likely less than I am paying now since it would be evenly split between everyone instead of just those that tip.

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