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Crypto tax evasion is 'pervasive'

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Re: Crypto tax evasion is 'pervasive'

#21

Post by mistercheph »

tgv wrote: post #6
warkdarrior wrote: post #2

Isn't that by design? Many/most crypto schemes are designed to democratize access to money and thus they disintermediate traditional players (banks, central banks, etc.). Of course governments and tax authorities are one such traditional player, so they will be disintermediated. The government calls it "tax evasion", while the crypto world calls it a feature.

> democratize access to money Is that the latest euphemism? Tell me, where can I get the money? A lot of it, please.

Try saving the local currency in a country with a government that is actively debasing its currency to fund the ventures of its aristocracy, and you will understand that having access to a secure, transferable store of the value of your work is not universal, but a privilege assured by the power of trillions of dollars of fighter jets.

Re: Crypto tax evasion is 'pervasive'

#22

Post by corry »

sealeck wrote: post #5
warkdarrior wrote: post #2

Isn't that by design? Many/most crypto schemes are designed to democratize access to money and thus they disintermediate traditional players (banks, central banks, etc.). Of course governments and tax authorities are one such traditional player, so they will be disintermediated. The government calls it "tax evasion", while the crypto world calls it a feature.

> Of course governments and tax authorities are one such traditional player, so they will be disintermediated. The government calls it "tax evasion", while the crypto world calls it a feature. Where do these people think tax revenue goes? Into a big black hole? The money goes to pay for the justice system (which protects property rights, prevents people from killing each other), build and maintain infrastructure of a…

Perhaps things aren't so binary on either side.

Some people using crypto are criminals, terrorists, and (perhaps less concerning albeit more numerous) tax-evaders. Some aren't.

And on the other side, some (much?) government spending is inefficient, highly-politicized, and perhaps contrary to someone's moral compass (e.g. the average American citizen sends $11.34 each year to Israel, or sends Uncle Sam a whopping $140/yr -- out of their own pockets -- to fund the 'War on Drugs' which disproportionately puts black men into prison for small amounts of personal cannabis possession). So yes, gov tax spending builds roads and defends property rights - but that doesn't mean it's all good. A reasonable person can take issue with both the size and targets of much of the spending.

Anyways, my point isn't to debate the pros/cons of particular government spending examples, but rather that the average person has not just reason but also a duty to assess how government spending happens, whether or not that aligns with their values, and to vote and organize appropriately to try to change that.

If you're already a bit more libertarian, skeptical of federal monetary policy, morally conflicted about how your tax dollars are spent, in tech with a love of technology, then ya you probably are going to like the fact that crypto is outside of the normal system.

Re: Crypto tax evasion is 'pervasive'

#23

Post by surfingdino »

How much of the tax evasion would disappear if we could pay taxes on crypto in crypto? The fact that the regulators scare banks away from allowing transfers to/from crypto exchanges whilst the IRS and HMRC demand taxes to be paid in USD or GBP makes the space prone to non-compliance and stifles innovation. So, either support legitimate crypto businesses and exchanges or let me pay tax on my meme coin gains in meme coin.

Re: Crypto tax evasion is 'pervasive'

#24

Post by worik »

OutOfHere wrote: post #14
bdcravens wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's also a group that's against the Federal Reserve, but that belief system tends to be congruent with the "taxation is theft" group

> the "taxation is theft" group Let's be real here. With compounding, total taxation takes away 90% of income. If that's not theft, I don't know what is. There would be an appropriate level of taxation that would be fair, perhaps 10%.

> With compounding, total taxation takes away >99% of income

That does not compute.

Perhaps you could explain that.

Re: Crypto tax evasion is 'pervasive'

#25

Post by OutOfHere »

bdcravens wrote: post #20
OutOfHere wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the "taxation is theft" group Let's be real here. With compounding, total taxation takes away 90% of income. If that's not theft, I don't know what is. There would be an appropriate level of taxation that would be fair, perhaps 10%.

Currently less than 4% of Americans save any money. To assume that any would save enough to compound instead of spend in the absence of taxes is naive.

So you think the hardworking 4% should suffer like the rest of them? Even though they pay more taxes? Taxation is supposed to be fair, but your approach isn't.

Re: Crypto tax evasion is 'pervasive'

#27

Post by xienze »

throwing_away wrote: post #16
sealeck wrote: post #4

I think this is unsurpring given that the crypto userbase seems to consist mostly of speculators and criminals.

Believe it or not, there are people that think real innovation is happening in crypto, and they also make investments and pay taxes. If you search around for crypto tax software, you'll find there's actual demand from people that want to pay taxes on their crypto.

> you'll find there's actual demand from people that want to pay taxes on their crypto.

I think that’s more of a “need to” thing rather than “want to”, yes even for the people that aren’t using crypto for criminal activity.

Re: Crypto tax evasion is 'pervasive'

#28

Post by decremental »

corry wrote: post #22
sealeck wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Of course governments and tax authorities are one such traditional player, so they will be disintermediated. The government calls it "tax evasion", while the crypto world calls it a feature. Where do these people think tax revenue goes? Into a big black hole? The money goes to pay for the justice system (which protects property rights, prevents people from killing each other), build and maintain infrastructure of a…

Perhaps things aren't so binary on either side. Some people using crypto are criminals, terrorists, and (perhaps less concerning albeit more numerous) tax-evaders. Some aren't. And on the other side, some (much?) government spending is inefficient, highly-politicized, and perhaps contrary to someone's moral compass (e.g. the average American citizen sends $11.34 each year to Israel, or sends Uncle Sam a whopping $140…

[dead]

Re: Crypto tax evasion is 'pervasive'

#29

Post by sandworm101 »

worik wrote: post #24
OutOfHere wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the "taxation is theft" group Let's be real here. With compounding, total taxation takes away 90% of income. If that's not theft, I don't know what is. There would be an appropriate level of taxation that would be fair, perhaps 10%.

> With compounding, total taxation takes away >99% of income That does not compute. Perhaps you could explain that.

I think he was aiming for disposable income, rather than all income.

Re: Crypto tax evasion is 'pervasive'

#30

Post by zarzavat »

sealeck wrote: post #5
warkdarrior wrote: post #2

Isn't that by design? Many/most crypto schemes are designed to democratize access to money and thus they disintermediate traditional players (banks, central banks, etc.). Of course governments and tax authorities are one such traditional player, so they will be disintermediated. The government calls it "tax evasion", while the crypto world calls it a feature.

> Of course governments and tax authorities are one such traditional player, so they will be disintermediated. The government calls it "tax evasion", while the crypto world calls it a feature. Where do these people think tax revenue goes? Into a big black hole? The money goes to pay for the justice system (which protects property rights, prevents people from killing each other), build and maintain infrastructure of a…

> Without the government we'd be much, much worse off.

Who is “we” here?

In some countries tax revenue goes to improving services, in some countries it goes to the President’s brother-in-law, in some countries it goes to military incursions that are morally repugnant.

Tax, like cryptocurrency, isn’t intrinsically good or bad. They are both tools that could be used for benevolent or malevolent purposes depending on who is using them.

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