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Australian employees now have the right to ignore work emails, calls after hours

reuters.com

151–160 of 449 posts

Re: Australian employees now have the right to ignore work emails, calls after hours

#151

Like in the UK where this already exists. In most contracts you get to sign a waiver. Show me the law and I’ll show you the loophole

You may be confusing the right to ignore out of hours comms with the Working Time Directive that the UK got with EU membership?

The UK doesn't have the former (yet). On the latter you are correct, I have signed away my right in every white collar job I've had. I couldn't sign the contract without signing that right away.

Re: Australian employees now have the right to ignore work emails, calls after hours

#152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The teacher situation is strange. One the one hand, they often do seem to work outside of school hours on lesson prep and marking. On the other hand, they generally don't work during school holidays (12 weeks/yr). Also, given that most school days here are ~9am to ~3pm, I wonder how much of that "after hours" work actually falls within the standard 40hr work week.

Like most things, there's a gaping chasm of variance between teachers that are phoning it in and teachers that want to engage their students in learning. I know a teacher who leaves for work at 6:30am, gets home after 5:30pm most nights, cooks dinner for the family, and spends the rest of her evening marking work and preparing lesson plans for the next few days. Then there's preparing reports, which is like a 6-week…

When you say preparing lesson plans, is that like printing out worksheets or is it literally planning out what the lesson is going to be?

I'm not a teacher so am obviously missing context, but I don't understand how this part isn't standardised for every teacher following the same curriculum.

It would be like asking each individual teacher to write a new textbook every year.

Re: Australian employees now have the right to ignore work emails, calls after hours

#153
post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's the benefit of working on a small team/startup. Whoever smelt it dealt it kind of situation. Basically, at first at least, whoever's application is erroring is getting a call when it breaks. It sounds bad, but it encourages everyone to write more fault tolerant code. Way moreso then a random bigcorp with an on call team.

I used to get called all the time because our in house infrastructure would fall over, and my apps would crash. It didn’t matter how many times I explained my apps couldn’t run without good infra, and that I wasn’t on that team, and that I had no access or authority to do anything… when my apps when down I got called. So actually, I really don’t like your idea.

Or, to be more specific, you don't like your company's implementation of their idea.

We have the same setup in my org, but we get to define alerts ourselves. All our own alerts are built so that they don't go off if the underlying infra is borked, and only if there's something we can actually do on our level. We are being kept honest because there is a big kerfuffle when an incident is reported by customers first (instead of alerting).

Re: Australian employees now have the right to ignore work emails, calls after hours

#155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Like most things, there's a gaping chasm of variance between teachers that are phoning it in and teachers that want to engage their students in learning. I know a teacher who leaves for work at 6:30am, gets home after 5:30pm most nights, cooks dinner for the family, and spends the rest of her evening marking work and preparing lesson plans for the next few days. Then there's preparing reports, which is like a 6-week…

When you say preparing lesson plans, is that like printing out worksheets or is it literally planning out what the lesson is going to be? I'm not a teacher so am obviously missing context, but I don't understand how this part isn't standardised for every teacher following the same curriculum. It would be like asking each individual teacher to write a new textbook every year.

Experienced teachers likely have it down. Or can just use whatever was done in previous years. But you have set standards changed every 10-20 years at least. And maybe new textbook that has things in bit different order. Or there is some topical thing. Lesson planning is really looking at book and items there thinking how much time going over it with current group takes and then considering what items or things are needed in addition to reach those goals for this lesson.

If you had to make a 1/2 hour presentation/workshop, there is some planning involved even if you can just copy paste the slides and training material.

Re: Australian employees now have the right to ignore work emails, calls after hours

#156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am from India and this is very common thing from Indian managers whether they are in India or working abroad (and I am sure this is not limited to India but since I am from there I am sharing this example). It's just a thing. I often am a pariah at workplace when it comes to views on work-life balance. So I have learnt to never get into discussions about it and just shut up and keep my head down while never giving…

This isn't some Indian specific thing. Private equity is destroying US infrastructure to make a quick buck. It's happening in almost every sector of the economy you can imagine. I'm not exaggerating when I say that PE firms are buying up nursing homes, transfering ownership of the land and building off into a separate entity, and have that entity charge the nursing home rent which keeps going up and up. This forces m…

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Re: Australian employees now have the right to ignore work emails, calls after hours

#157

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Like most things, there's a gaping chasm of variance between teachers that are phoning it in and teachers that want to engage their students in learning. I know a teacher who leaves for work at 6:30am, gets home after 5:30pm most nights, cooks dinner for the family, and spends the rest of her evening marking work and preparing lesson plans for the next few days. Then there's preparing reports, which is like a 6-week…

When you say preparing lesson plans, is that like printing out worksheets or is it literally planning out what the lesson is going to be? I'm not a teacher so am obviously missing context, but I don't understand how this part isn't standardised for every teacher following the same curriculum. It would be like asking each individual teacher to write a new textbook every year.

It probably depends on the country, but in my country (Germany), the government only defines outlines of what knowledge and skills the students are expected to acquire. The teachers are expected to design a specific curriculum to convey these skills (though obviously constrained by outside factors, most prominently the available set of textbooks).

Re: Australian employees now have the right to ignore work emails, calls after hours

#158
post #149

I thought that's normal? I switch off my work phone and laptop and then I do not even know if I get any mails ... is this only a thing in Germany?

Some people work on weekends even in Germany. Saturday is normal workday according German law. It’s more or less personal preference. At least one has a choice.

some people work at night and on sunday ... i didn't know that means i'm not allowed to sleep. thanks for letting me know.

Re: Australian employees now have the right to ignore work emails, calls after hours

#159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Like most things, there's a gaping chasm of variance between teachers that are phoning it in and teachers that want to engage their students in learning. I know a teacher who leaves for work at 6:30am, gets home after 5:30pm most nights, cooks dinner for the family, and spends the rest of her evening marking work and preparing lesson plans for the next few days. Then there's preparing reports, which is like a 6-week…

When you say preparing lesson plans, is that like printing out worksheets or is it literally planning out what the lesson is going to be? I'm not a teacher so am obviously missing context, but I don't understand how this part isn't standardised for every teacher following the same curriculum. It would be like asking each individual teacher to write a new textbook every year.

Planning out what the lesson is going to be.

Re: Australian employees now have the right to ignore work emails, calls after hours

#160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But completely eliminating planned on-call rotations is not part of the goal. It certainly should be. You want your app supported 24x7 then pay for three shifts. If the government won’t make it a law then IT workers can make it a demand when they unionize.

Tripling the cost of running a tech company in Australia is effectively outlawing startups.

That’s right, we should continue to exploit workers instead because of vague contract terms that they “must work extra hours when required”. Workers should remember that the business is more important than their non contracted time.

The capitalism dream right?

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