Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Lidl's Cloud Gambit: Europe's Shift to Sovereign Computing

horovits.medium.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

141–150 of 420 posts

Re: Lidl's Cloud Gambit: Europe's Shift to Sovereign Computing

#141

Post by mathverse »

lifestyleguru wrote: post #139
throwaway215234 wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Seriously DACH mentality and influence has been devastating on serious tech development in Europe German corporations (and politics) are full of bean counters, bureaucrats and underachievers. It's filled with people who love to talk, excessively plan, draw flowcharts and build frameworks - essentially everything except getting shit done.

German shit is done in Poland, Romania, and Belarus, and for less than 50-60k EUR pa.

No longer true. 40-60k would be reasonable in those countries as well.

Re: Lidl's Cloud Gambit: Europe's Shift to Sovereign Computing

#142

Post by dathinab »

formerly_proven wrote: post #73
shortrounddev2 wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Low salaries to me indicates they believe it is a Germanic ideal to pay subpar wages for highly skilled engineers? I don't think it's a mentality thing, personally, I think it just speaks to the weakness of the European economy for the last 20ish years

Highly skilled engineers leave to places where they get their money's worth (i.e. not germany/eu).

honestly if you include other costs e.g. for acceptable health insurance, having children, eating reasonable healthy, general quality of live things etc. the sallies often aren't bad at all

Sure if you are one of the best of the best and are willing to take high risk for high reward and in general give up QoL/Work live Balance then especially in SV you have better chances to make a lot of money.

But for most skilled engineers they can get their money worth in the EU, through depending on their priorities and goals in live.

Like to put it in context to have a similar quality of live in US I think I would need to earn around 50% more before tax and that is even through US has much less tax. Through that 50% more also would allow me more flexibility for reducing my QoL at the current time, invest it and long time have more money (or much less if you mess up). So again a question of priorities.

Re: Lidl's Cloud Gambit: Europe's Shift to Sovereign Computing

#143

Post by KeplerBoy »

morsch wrote: post #107
mathverse wrote: post #21

Yea this is so gonna work with them paying 50-60k/pa for engineers. Seriously DACH mentality and influence has been devastating on serious tech development in Europe

> 50-60k/pa for engineers Is that, like, actual information, or just an educated guess based on some industry average.

That's definitely the kind of salary you'd be looking at after an undergraduate tech degree in Austria or secondary cities in Germany.

Re: Lidl's Cloud Gambit: Europe's Shift to Sovereign Computing

#144

Post by mvanbaak »

waihtis wrote: post #5
outside1234 wrote: post #2

This is not about privacy or sovereign clouds because at least AWS and Azure have those already in Europe. It’s about protectionism and tweaking the law to favor local companies.

How so - Lidl created something for their own demand, and started selling it to externals and found demand. Nothing protectionist in that

this is also how AWS started. amazon created a setup they needed and found out that they can sell it to others as well.

Re: Lidl's Cloud Gambit: Europe's Shift to Sovereign Computing

#145

Post by Certhas »

tgsovlerkhgsel wrote: post #129
arianvanp wrote: post #22

Gaia-X is a disaster. The article misrepresents it. Gaia-X is not a framework for what a European cloud should look like. This would be useful. In beautiful EU bureaucratic style It's a framework for how to talk about how a European Cloud could look like. It's not about technical standards. It's about how we can talk about how we can think of maybe eventually deciding on how we can come up with standards that might o…

While most Western governments have gotten increasingly good at communicating with their citizens (i.e. making their web sites and forms accessible in human language, rather than bureaucrat language), and often even go so far as to offer versions in "Simple English" or local-language equivalents, the EU seems to be going the opposite way. I'd consider myself reasonably accustomed to and able to deal with bureaucracy…

Because the EU is not a national government. It issues no passports. It has no citizens. It levies no taxes. It has no army. It's an organisation that coordinates sovereign states. Often it doesn't even set the law directly but establishes a framework that allows it to specify some requirements that national legislative bodies then have to turn into actual legislation. Frameworks for how to talk about things is very apropos for what the EU is and for how it came about.

I am not defending this state of affairs. Simply pointing out that it's a category error to compare it to national governments. I think it would be good if we had more of an EU state. It seemed to be heading there 25ish years ago. But the nation states do have little appetite to cede authority to the central institutions, so that's probably not on the table. And it's also undeniable that as a coordination mechanism the EU has been spectacularly successful. The fact that people treat it as a national government is proof of that.

Re: Lidl's Cloud Gambit: Europe's Shift to Sovereign Computing

#146

Post by karaterobot »

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #69
p1esk wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wow, 5 years later and what have they actually accomplished? Look at the milestones section: https://gaia-x.eu/what-is-gaia-x/about-gaia-x/

As I get older and a little lazier, sometimes I think I might want to find a way to get a completely pointless job that gives me a paycheck where all I have to do is write documents that nobody ever reads. Then I look at something like this Gaia-X "milestones" list and think "Meh, this is probably not the job for me..."

[raises hand]

It's not so bad. Looooong lunches.

Re: Lidl's Cloud Gambit: Europe's Shift to Sovereign Computing

#147

Post by bartekpacia »

snowpid wrote: post #106
szszrk wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's exactly what is going on nowadays, anyway. In Poland we have Chmura Krajowa (national cloud), aimed at public, non profit and finance companies. It's basically more controlled local Azure and GPC region.

In Polish people don't use Cloud but Chmura?

It depends. If we’re talking about e.g. GCP we use “cloud”, but Chmura Krajowa is a Polish product and it has a Polish name, so we use “chmura”. We basically use the original name in this context.

Re: Lidl's Cloud Gambit: Europe's Shift to Sovereign Computing

#148

Post by vesinisa »

bengale wrote: post #113
albertgoeswoof wrote: post #47

I run a European cloud service, 80% of our customers are basically looking for a European alternative to the big clouds. The market is huge and in my opinion underserved. What makes it very exciting is that there not too much innovation required to compete

What are the other 20% with you for? What is the benefit that your customers see in using an European cloud?

As far as I know, the companies / service providers would love to be able tell their customers that 100% of their data is only stored and processed in the EU. It makes everything GDPR-related simpler for companies, and could be turned into a good advertisement for consumers.

Re: Lidl's Cloud Gambit: Europe's Shift to Sovereign Computing

#150

Post by toomuchtodo »

n_ary wrote: post #76
p1esk wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wow, 5 years later and what have they actually accomplished? Look at the milestones section: https://gaia-x.eu/what-is-gaia-x/about-gaia-x/

[flagged]

The same could be said about US financial services, US legacy auto, etc. Incumbents want to stay incumbents with little effort, this isn’t news.

Pay people who do, not people who write white papers and frameworks, and spend material effort on “thought leadership.”

Post reply on HN