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Climate policies that achieved major emission reductions

science.org

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Re: Climate policies that achieved major emission reductions

#41

Post by DaanDL »

drdrey wrote: post #10
sien wrote: post #7

Let's have a look at France's emissions : https://ourworldindata.org/co2/country/france Somehow, from 1973 they went from 10t C02 per capita to 4.8 t per capita in 2022. Their GDP at the same went from 264 Bn to ~2779 Bn https://www.macrotrends.net/global-metrics/countries/FRA/fra... Whatever mysterious method of C02 reduction they used should be investigated.

> These figures reflect ‘production-based’ emissions, so do not correct for traded goods. moving manufacturing overseas

This^^^

I'm tired of: "The EU doesn't emit as much as China does". Let's account for all the garbage we let China produce and then look at the numbers again.

Re: Climate policies that achieved major emission reductions

#42

Post by AtlasBarfed »

1) standards

2) subsidies

3) financing

All three which I would argue we are woefully behind on in the US for EVs and solar.

There should be a ten year subsidy on new cars in the range of 10000$ that decreases 10% per year if they are EVs or PHEVs with 40 mile all electric ranges.

There should be a tax on new ice cars that increases by 4% of the retail car cost every year.

Of course we should have a similar increasing tax on gasoline, but that is more regressive.

Re: Climate policies that achieved major emission reductions

#43

Post by AtlasBarfed »

DaanDL wrote: post #41
drdrey wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> These figures reflect ‘production-based’ emissions, so do not correct for traded goods. moving manufacturing overseas

This^^^ I'm tired of: "The EU doesn't emit as much as China does". Let's account for all the garbage we let China produce and then look at the numbers again.

The great enemy of supply side environment regulation is simple arbitrage with overseas manufacturing to the lowest common denominator of controls

Which sadly is usually absolutely no controls

Re: Climate policies that achieved major emission reductions

#44

Post by AtlasBarfed »

dmagee wrote: post #8
sien wrote: post #7

Let's have a look at France's emissions : https://ourworldindata.org/co2/country/france Somehow, from 1973 they went from 10t C02 per capita to 4.8 t per capita in 2022. Their GDP at the same went from 264 Bn to ~2779 Bn https://www.macrotrends.net/global-metrics/countries/FRA/fra... Whatever mysterious method of C02 reduction they used should be investigated.

Nuclear power.

If you have a price competitive modular rapidly approved and scaled meltdown proof plant design that can be built in a couple years.

Unfortunately, that does not exist in nuclear power. As in, not a single one of those requirements is fulfilled by any commercial design.

Re: Climate policies that achieved major emission reductions

#45

Post by mike_hearn »

The article talks about successful interventions. It's problematic that the article doesn't put this in context: no specific events or policies are visible in the growth rate of CO2 in the atmosphere since records began. It's a smooth up-and-to-the-right line with slowly increasing acceleration.

https://gml.noaa.gov/webdata/ccgg/trends/co2_data_mlo.png

Things you might intuitively expect to be visible but aren't:

• COVID lockdowns (i.e. aviation shutdown).

• Germany's phaseout of nuclear power and return to lignite.

• The collapse of the USSR.

• Any kind of global climate agreement.

• The explosion of cheap air travel.

• The enormous drop in solar/wind costs in the 2010s.

• Chinese adoption of capitalism and consequent industrialization in the 1990s.

If even global lockdowns had no impact on CO2 levels it's fair to say there are no actual or conceivable government policies that will be successful at reducing emissions any time soon. The authors of this paper aren't going to mention that though, otherwise examining 1500 different government policies might seem a bit pointless and the discussion would have to move to adaptation, which they don't like conceptually.

Re: Climate policies that achieved major emission reductions

#46

Post by ericmcer »

DaanDL wrote: post #41
drdrey wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> These figures reflect ‘production-based’ emissions, so do not correct for traded goods. moving manufacturing overseas

This^^^ I'm tired of: "The EU doesn't emit as much as China does". Let's account for all the garbage we let China produce and then look at the numbers again.

Everyone knows how environmentally friendly shipping everything 8000 miles is. Climate policy just makes stuff nicer for people who live in rich countries because the pollution is further away from their personal bubble.

Re: Climate policies that achieved major emission reductions

#47

Post by giarc »

kuhewa wrote: post #24
giarc wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is the seaweed actually in use beyond some test farms or research herds?

Apparently it has been commercially available to cattle growers since 2022 but not sure on uptake https://www.future-feed.com/buy-asparagopsis

I wonder if "low carbon cattle" exists in the grocery stores. I'd actually pay a premium for this.

Re: Climate policies that achieved major emission reductions

#48

Post by throw0101d »

drdrey wrote: post #10
sien wrote: post #7

Let's have a look at France's emissions : https://ourworldindata.org/co2/country/france Somehow, from 1973 they went from 10t C02 per capita to 4.8 t per capita in 2022. Their GDP at the same went from 264 Bn to ~2779 Bn https://www.macrotrends.net/global-metrics/countries/FRA/fra... Whatever mysterious method of C02 reduction they used should be investigated.

> These figures reflect ‘production-based’ emissions, so do not correct for traded goods. moving manufacturing overseas

> moving manufacturing overseas

At least per the available data from 1990, France has lowered its consumption-based CO₂ emissions in absolute terms:

* https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/consumption-co2-emissions...

And given the population has also risen since 1990:

* https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/population?time=1990..lat...

even if total emissions had stayed the same, per capita numbers would have gone down.

The same if often said of the US, and it is not true either:

* https://www.noahpinion.blog/p/no-the-us-didnt-outsource-our-...

Re: Climate policies that achieved major emission reductions

#50

Post by kuhewa »

giarc wrote: post #47
kuhewa wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apparently it has been commercially available to cattle growers since 2022 but not sure on uptake https://www.future-feed.com/buy-asparagopsis

I wonder if "low carbon cattle" exists in the grocery stores. I'd actually pay a premium for this.

https://www.wired.com/story/low-carbon-beef/
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