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Roblox is the biggest game in the world, but is unprofitable

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Re: Roblox is the biggest game in the world, but is unprofitable

#191

Post by iainmerrick »

ElCapitanMarkla wrote: post #88

My kids have started playing Roblox recently and they have started asking for some Robux so they can buy crap... I really don't get how so many people are into spending dollars on this stuff. Everything they wanted was ~$10-20 NZD and it was just throw away stuff, like a costume, etc. And then it's only useful in that one game you have brought it for. It blows my mind that it ever got this popular.

It's fashion. It's the same phenomenon as kids wanting to spend $100 to get the coolest shoes (in the real world).

Re: Roblox is the biggest game in the world, but is unprofitable

#192

Post by actualwitch »

dagmx wrote: post #145
justinclift wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Steam reportedly puts in a bunch of effort to earn it though. Whereas Apple's relationship seems more predatory/antagonistic (at best).

You think Steam puts in more effort than providing graphics APIs, system frameworks for everything from networking to controller handling, UI libraries, educational sessions and security critical updates? Like, one may argue that the 30% isn’t valid (and it’s 15% for the majority of devs) but to say Steam does more is absurd. I’m curious if people who hold this opinion have actually been involved in the process of re…

> valve does contribute to gaming on Linux

They only do it because they are painfully aware their rent-seeking behavior is entirely at whims of ms/apple and they want to have some moat.

Re: Roblox is the biggest game in the world, but is unprofitable

#193

Post by drw85 »

jack_pp wrote: post #100
ElCapitanMarkla wrote: post #88

My kids have started playing Roblox recently and they have started asking for some Robux so they can buy crap... I really don't get how so many people are into spending dollars on this stuff. Everything they wanted was ~$10-20 NZD and it was just throw away stuff, like a costume, etc. And then it's only useful in that one game you have brought it for. It blows my mind that it ever got this popular.

Because kids aren't utilitarian. They want shiny things impulsively now in whatever niche game they are playing at the moment. Or want to keep up with their friends who got cool stuff to keep status. Doesn't matter to them that they'll switch games in a week and lose everything.

It's not only kids that buy these. I know a lot of 40+ year old men that buy skins and useless junk in video games all the time. They spend a ton of money on cosmetic junk in short lived video games. It's puzzling to me, but i see it all the time.

Re: Roblox is the biggest game in the world, but is unprofitable

#194

Post by nottorp »

ccozan wrote: post #186
nottorp wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Someone in the food chain does take less in some EU countries. Not all. The commissions are capped by law in some parts, but not others. As a small sample, in RO i think a large store chain pays like 0.5%. The consequence is credit card reward programs are either non existent or something like 0.1% cashback. The other consequence is you can pay by card almost anywhere. On the other hand I've been to NL and small stor…

Not sure if you actually been to RO but every small shop has 3-4 payment terminals, each bank branded, and based on the card they use a different terminal thus ensuring minimal charge or even 0. In DE or NL, you operate via an intermediary ( like payone, etc ) and a single terminal. Maybe here comes the difference. PS. Larger shops/markets ( like kaufland, carrefour, etc ) have also just one, but I guess they negocia…

> Not sure if you actually been to RO

No, I was born and live there.

My groceries kiosk has just the single terminal.

Where I shop, only Dedeman, Altex and the eMag showroom still ask me what bank is the card from, and they're nowhere near small...

Edit: Hmm. Cozy? Small world...

Re: Roblox is the biggest game in the world, but is unprofitable

#195

Post by actualwitch »

modeless wrote: post #95
saint- wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Curious, why is Roblox in violation of Apple's App store policies?

> Apps should be self-contained in their bundles, and may not read or write data outside the designated container area, nor may they download, install, or execute code which introduces or changes features or functionality of the app, including other apps. Roblox is in clear violation of this clause, downloading and executing entire games written in Lua. Apple does have an exception to this policy for HTML5 games and…

Have you heard about codepush? Apps are routinely ignoring this requirement and apple does literally nothing, as recently discussed on hn:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=41146779

Re: Roblox is the biggest game in the world, but is unprofitable

#196

Post by sitkack »

dagmx wrote: post #145
justinclift wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Steam reportedly puts in a bunch of effort to earn it though. Whereas Apple's relationship seems more predatory/antagonistic (at best).

You think Steam puts in more effort than providing graphics APIs, system frameworks for everything from networking to controller handling, UI libraries, educational sessions and security critical updates? Like, one may argue that the 30% isn’t valid (and it’s 15% for the majority of devs) but to say Steam does more is absurd. I’m curious if people who hold this opinion have actually been involved in the process of re…

Those APIs are paid for by the owner of the phone. Charging developers (and the consumer) 30% to allow someone to distribute an app is utterly ridiculous. Framing it like Apple built these things and you are only paying 30% is in deep sycophant territory.

Re: Roblox is the biggest game in the world, but is unprofitable

#197

Post by svnt »

harry8 wrote: post #15
snihalani wrote: post #12

Where is the money coming from if they are not profitable?

It's an accounting trick. 1) Make tons of cash. 2) Invest the cash back in the business. 3) Record this investment on the financials as an expense. 4) The expenses inflated by investment spending means you declare no profit and probably pay no tax on that profit you just hid. The alternative is: 1) declare profit 2) Pay tax on it 3) Reinvest what's left after the taxman took a cut. Which would you choose if you were…

The accountants can’t be bothered because your comment isn’t even using basic terms correctly.

Your comment suggests that reinvested cash is being "hidden" as expenses, but in reality, these reinvestments are usually recorded as capital expenditures (CapEx) rather than operating expenses (OpEx), depending on the nature of the investment. While CapEx can be depreciated over time, it is not typically expensed immediately in the way operating costs are.

The implication that companies can completely avoid taxes by reinvesting is misleading. Even though reinvestments may reduce taxable income through depreciation or other deductions, this is a legal and common accounting practice, not necessarily an attempt to "hide" profits. There are also tax laws in many jurisdictions which limit the extent to which such deductions can offset income.

Your understanding also conflates profit with cash flow. Profit is an accounting concept that reflects the net income after all expenses (including taxes). Cash flow, on the other hand, reflects the actual cash generated by the business. Reinvesting profits does not "hide" cash flow but rather allocates it to future growth.

Companies don't simply choose between declaring profit and reinvesting to avoid taxes. The decision to reinvest is often driven by strategic goals, such as expanding operations, developing new products, or acquiring other businesses.

Reinvestment reduces the company's taxable income and thus the taxes owed, but it does not eliminate taxes or "hide" the profits. The company benefits from reinvesting by potentially generating more revenue in the future from the new product, which should generate more tax revenue down the road instead of restricting growth now.

Here is an approximation of your comment translated from accounting into software development, minus the part where you misunderstand essential terms:

> It’s ridiculous that software developers waste so much time writing tests for their code. If the code is written correctly in the first place, you wouldn’t need tests at all. Instead of wasting time on tests, developers should focus on just writing perfect code from the start. It’s clear that the whole idea of ‘unit testing’ is just a way for developers to justify their jobs and take longer to finish projects. Shouldn’t we just hire better developers who don’t need to write tests?

Re: Roblox is the biggest game in the world, but is unprofitable

#198

Post by ccozan »

nottorp wrote: post #194
ccozan wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure if you actually been to RO but every small shop has 3-4 payment terminals, each bank branded, and based on the card they use a different terminal thus ensuring minimal charge or even 0. In DE or NL, you operate via an intermediary ( like payone, etc ) and a single terminal. Maybe here comes the difference. PS. Larger shops/markets ( like kaufland, carrefour, etc ) have also just one, but I guess they negocia…

> Not sure if you actually been to RO No, I was born and live there. My groceries kiosk has just the single terminal. Where I shop, only Dedeman, Altex and the eMag showroom still ask me what bank is the card from, and they're nowhere near small... Edit: Hmm. Cozy? Small world...

ha, Torp! Nice!

But yes, is a mix/jungle of options. But I find fascinating that paying with cards has a far more adoption than some places in western world.

Re: Roblox is the biggest game in the world, but is unprofitable

#199

Post by J_cst »

jack_pp wrote: post #100
ElCapitanMarkla wrote: post #88

My kids have started playing Roblox recently and they have started asking for some Robux so they can buy crap... I really don't get how so many people are into spending dollars on this stuff. Everything they wanted was ~$10-20 NZD and it was just throw away stuff, like a costume, etc. And then it's only useful in that one game you have brought it for. It blows my mind that it ever got this popular.

Because kids aren't utilitarian. They want shiny things impulsively now in whatever niche game they are playing at the moment. Or want to keep up with their friends who got cool stuff to keep status. Doesn't matter to them that they'll switch games in a week and lose everything.

Some time ago I read an article explaining that initially games used to sell upgrades which were making the player stronger in multi-player games. The net result was that the games were loosing players because that mechanic was seen as unfair (pay to win). So they switched to aesthetics enhancements only and that resulted the correct strategy to have in game sales and not loosing players. Unfortunately cannot remember further details to prove this memory, sorry.

Re: Roblox is the biggest game in the world, but is unprofitable

#200

Post by drexlspivey »

thomas34298 wrote: post #181
modeless wrote: post #17

The bigger question about Roblox is how and why they got their special treatment from Apple. The whole concept of Roblox is in blatant violation of Apple's App Store policies. I believe they are significantly shielded from competition because who else can get that kind of ongoing and reliable relief from Apple's famously picky and capricious App Store reviewers? Maybe Roblox is happy to pay Apple their 30% in exchang…

I think the same argument could be made for Twitter/X. The app stores by Google and Apple specifically disallow pornographic material, yet the app is full of it. Once you're big and important enough, the rules mostly don't apply for you anymore. Of course, if they tried to circumvent the app store tax directly within the app, there would be consequences, but as long as Google/Apple can make a profit, it's okay it see…

Can an aggregator/distributor be liable for user created content? You can find porn in Reddit or Google Search and these apps are still in the app store so I don’t think they are getting any special treatment.
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