Java is preparing to co-bundling and native binaries

#1

Post by Mitt » Mon, Jun 18, 2012, 8:18 AM UTC

Java is preparing to co-bundling and native binaries
blogs.oracle.com

Re: Java is preparing to co-bundling and native binaries

#2

Post by Mitt » Mon, Jun 18, 2012, 8:19 AM UTC

The posting is about JavaFX, but in reality it will be a general mechanism for JVM apps. Oracle is doing this preparation, so that your JVM apps (Java, Clojure, Scala, etc.) can run under Android and iOS.

Re: Java is preparing to co-bundling and native binaries

#3

Post by sgt » Mon, Jun 18, 2012, 8:29 AM UTC

Finally - why did this come now, and not 4-5 years ago? I apologize for asking such a question, but it's the first thing that comes to mind. Principally I do like JavaFX, and this approach will work - given that these binary bundles don't end up like 80MB monsters.

Re: Java is preparing to co-bundling and native binaries

#4

Post by vetler » Mon, Jun 18, 2012, 8:31 AM UTC

Mitt wrote: post #2

The posting is about JavaFX, but in reality it will be a general mechanism for JVM apps. Oracle is doing this preparation, so that your JVM apps (Java, Clojure, Scala, etc.) can run under Android and iOS.

What's the connection to Android and iOS here, isn't it just packaging?

Re: Java is preparing to co-bundling and native binaries

#5

Post by densh » Mon, Jun 18, 2012, 8:34 AM UTC

Mitt wrote: post #2

The posting is about JavaFX, but in reality it will be a general mechanism for JVM apps. Oracle is doing this preparation, so that your JVM apps (Java, Clojure, Scala, etc.) can run under Android and iOS.

Nothing has been said about packaging for Android or iOS. From the info that's actually in the article -- currently it targets desktop applications.

From my point of view, iOS is extremely improbable target unless Apple changes their application requirements. Currently they do not allow use of any 3rd party JIT on iOS and Java is all about JIT.

Moreover JavaFX doesn't even run on Android or iOS at the moment (even without this new kind of packaging).

Re: Java is preparing to co-bundling and native binaries

#6

Post by bni » Mon, Jun 18, 2012, 8:55 AM UTC

The Java way has always been: To run this, click on the .bat file or type java -jar myapp.jar. And some people wonder why Java has been such a failure on the desktop.

This should have been in Java from the beginning, instead of outsourcing this functionality to third parties (Mainly Windows only installer applications that sucks, and also isnt used that much).

That said, I think it is misguided to include a JRE in the bundle. The correct way would be something like OS X Lion has, promt the user if Java is not installed. and then do a more or less automatic install of Java, in the system.

Re: Java is preparing to co-bundling and native binaries

#7

Post by wiradikusuma » Mon, Jun 18, 2012, 8:55 AM UTC

Anyone using JavaFX? I remember it came out as a Flash/Flex contender, but didn't make the cut (which is too bad, I kinda like the language). Considering Adobe pushing HTML5, I find it weird Oracle still pushing Java for Rich Internet Applications.

Re: Java is preparing to co-bundling and native binaries

#8

Post by densh » Mon, Jun 18, 2012, 8:59 AM UTC

bni wrote: post #6

The Java way has always been: To run this, click on the .bat file or type java -jar myapp.jar. And some people wonder why Java has been such a failure on the desktop. This should have been in Java from the beginning, instead of outsourcing this functionality to third parties (Mainly Windows only installer applications that sucks, and also isnt used that much). That said, I think it is misguided to include a JRE in th…

IMO the correct way is to include subset of JRE that's actually required for given application. This can lead to relatively small total application size and deployments that do not require any knowledge of java and java world from end user. Having one JRE for all apps on the system is nice but it's usually not needed.

Re: Java is preparing to co-bundling and native binaries

#9

Post by arturnt » Mon, Jun 18, 2012, 9:00 AM UTC

bni wrote: post #6

The Java way has always been: To run this, click on the .bat file or type java -jar myapp.jar. And some people wonder why Java has been such a failure on the desktop. This should have been in Java from the beginning, instead of outsourcing this functionality to third parties (Mainly Windows only installer applications that sucks, and also isnt used that much). That said, I think it is misguided to include a JRE in th…

Spoken like someone who knows nothing about Java. There are a bunch of apps written in Java web start(ie yEd), which involves just clicking on a link. Off the top of my head, some very popular Java apps are Eclipse/Intellij or Azureus.

Re: Java is preparing to co-bundling and native binaries

#10

Post by bni » Mon, Jun 18, 2012, 9:04 AM UTC

arturnt wrote: post #9

bni wrote: post #6

The Java way has always been: To run this, click on the .bat file or type java -jar myapp.jar. And some people wonder why Java has been such a failure on the desktop. This should have been in Java from the beginning, instead of outsourcing this functionality to third parties (Mainly Windows only installer applications that sucks, and also isnt used that much). That said, I think it is misguided to include a JRE in th…

Spoken like someone who knows nothing about Java. There are a bunch of apps written in Java web start(ie yEd), which involves just clicking on a link. Off the top of my head, some very popular Java apps are Eclipse/Intellij or Azureus.

I use IntelliJ daily, and the install experience is "devloper friendly", not exactly end user friendly. Dont get me started on Eclipse install process.

JWS is awful. It is totally not the way users expect to install applications.