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US Government wants to make it easier for you to click the 'unsubscribe' button

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Re: US Government wants to make it easier for you to click the 'unsubscribe' button

#211

Post by [deleted] »

fsckboy wrote: post #176
dataflow wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am well aware of that, but there is a very huge and crucial difference between putting something in the newspaper for the sake of public dissemination vs. for the sake of making sure one specific known private entity gets the information. The only case I can recall off the top of my head for the latter is for things like service of judicial papers, and even then as a last resort, only when direct attempts to reach…

> there is a very huge and crucial difference between putting something in the newspaper for the sake of public dissemination vs. for the sake of making sure one specific known private entity gets the information yes, and that huge and crucial difference in this case is that the entities in question have attorneys on staff, and those attorneys understand their responsibilities on behalf of the corporation

[deleted]

Re: US Government wants to make it easier for you to click the 'unsubscribe' button

#212

Post by acdha »

tialaramex wrote: post #108
nanoservices wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is zero incentive for a company to invest in tooling and tech to make processes that lose them customers more efficient. This is something that has to be regulated and enforced. I just don't see a c-suit clamoring to spend money on making it easier to leave.

There is a reason to invest in this, the rationale goes as follows: Some of my customers will legitimately need to cancel, unsubscribe, stop using, or whatever, but they like the product. If I piss these customers off, they may recommend against using it, and refuse to ever use it again so I should accept that they're leaving with grace and maybe they'll return later. You can offer to "pause" a subscription for examp…

I have a good example of this dynamic using Comcast: when we left New Haven, I had to spend a couple hours in line at a dingy, poorly staffed office terminating my account (the dude working there was fine, he needed coworkers) and then a couple months of “accidentally” still billing me. They could afford to be sloppy on billing and cancellation where I’d lived because in 2008 the competition was (I am not making this up) 128kpbs ISDN and 768-1Mbps DSL since the phone company had badly neglected its wiring.

In addition to being illegal, this was short sighted because they’re a national company. Comcast/Xfinity is one of three gigabit choices in my neighborhood and they periodically send offers with competitive pricing but each time I remember what dealing with them was like and toss it into the shredder. I’m sure the regional office would say they’re better run than the New England one, or that they have a better system, but I’m not going to find out, and there’s no way they skimped enough to save more than they could have made with over a decade of service in a new region.

Re: US Government wants to make it easier for you to click the 'unsubscribe' button

#213

Post by zeekaran »

b112 wrote: post #65
mkoubaa wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm almost as severe. I look for an unsubscribe button in the email. I click it. If I am not immediately unsubscribed from everything, I mark the email as spam.

I won't do business with companies that spam me. Here I am, already giving you money, and you want to spam me?! Even after I clicked unsubscribe? The worst are the BS claims of "account status emails", which are just spam. I moved my entire portfolio to another bank, filed a complaint, then filed complaints as I closed each account/card. The goal to have plenty of record as to why. Screw that.

> I won't do business with companies that spam me.

I just wouldn't be able to do business.

Re: US Government wants to make it easier for you to click the 'unsubscribe' button

#214

Post by acdha »

theptip wrote: post #103

The correct policy here is not mandating a “button” or even “the same number of steps to unsubscribe as to subscribe”, rather the government should just mandate adherence to a simple protocol. Then we can just unsubscribe in our mail clients (gmail already tries to do this). If you mandate a button, then each site will put it in a different place. It’s frustrating to see the lack of technical competence cause us to l…

This “government stupid, me smart” stuff is pretty tedious. You’re not even talking about the right concept – this is about unwanted recurring bills – but wanted to race to solving the simple part so quickly that you didn’t read the first paragraph.

The cookie consent law proposal similarly isn’t that simple. Nobody made their site worse because the EU forced them to, they did it because they’re trying to build opposition to privacy regulation. If you used a header not much would change because you’d have businesses arguing that the header could be set by accident or that the standard names didn’t represent their situation exactly. There’s a social problem here which can’t be solved with an IETF draft.

Re: US Government wants to make it easier for you to click the 'unsubscribe' button

#215

Post by barryrandall »

caseysoftware wrote: post #185

Apply the same to political candidates, campaigns, and PACs and I'll consider taking it seriously.

To quote other posters: this isn't about email. But, this provision doesn't include the usual exemptions for politicians/campaigns, so if you ever set up recurring donations to a campaign, this might require that they behave with decency.

Re: US Government wants to make it easier for you to click the 'unsubscribe' button

#216

Post by jkaplowitz »

tomschwiha wrote: post #113
jkaplowitz wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What EU-wide law requires it to be as easy to cancel as to sign up? I’m sitting in Germany right now and I’m unaware of any such law - though it might very well be recent and not fully transposed into German law, or might be situational or not widely complied with. It’s a good idea though, absolutely.

There is a law that requires that subscriptions can be cancelled online within "the click of a button" with automatic confirmation. (since 2022) If no such option to cancel is implemented by the provider the minimum contract duration is void and you can cancel immediately. German reference: https://www.verbraucherzentrale.de/vertraege-reklamation/kue...

Good news! Annoyingly financial services, including insurance, are an exception. But this handles many cases.

Re: US Government wants to make it easier for you to click the 'unsubscribe' button

#217

Post by bredren »

dfxm12 wrote: post #165
bredren wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The timing of this and other announcements is not by accident though. Expect a handful of populist announcements leading up to some "October" surprise that has been in the works for some time. It will be most obvious when it is generally favorable and can proceed without the need for two-party agreement.

Personally, I don't care when the government does something generally favorable. If you think this is just a vote grab, I would invite you to consider similar consumer protection action by this administration, most recently around junk fees, whose timing was not really around a general election. Of course, these really aren't big enough needle movers to be so cynical about & I trust this as another small and steady s…

I’m aware of the junk fee work and that is a fair point. And I agree it was somewhat weak, particularly if held up to what some other countries do to protect their people from businesses.

Biden’s last ditch attempt to hold on was discussing actual action on SCOTUS.

That campaign death rattle alone seems to have been enough evidence to me that push come to shove these folks will force something that results in more support, especially if it means keeping their job.

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