Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

How a Mexican Drug Cartel Makes Its Billions

nytimes.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

111–120 of 248 posts

Re: How a Mexican Drug Cartel Makes Its Billions

#111

Post by vlisivka »

pjscott wrote: post #102
vlisivka wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What will happen to consumers when prices will be so low, so no body will want to sell drugs, because they are no longer profitable?

Hi! This is the Market Economics Fairy! I help supply and demand equilibrate everywhere! If there is unmet demand for a fairly easy-to-grow cash crop, then it means that the prices are too low! Raise them, and farmland will switch from other commodities as it becomes marginally profitable to do so! Sincerely, the Market Economics Fairy! (Full disclosure: I'm just borrowing this character because it's suddenly relevan…

So, if you will be legal drug seller and you will be tight on money, what you will do? Just invest into few small doses and you will have clients for life...

Re: How a Mexican Drug Cartel Makes Its Billions

#112

Post by vlisivka »

vlisivka wrote: post #88
blazingice wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It looks like you're being downvoted, so I'll provide a reason. Alcohol is legal. The gangs that formed around producing, smuggling, and selling alcohol (e.g. Capone) are gone. The hope is that once other drugs are legal, the same thing happens to their producers.

So if everything illegal will be legal, like in America before USA, then all gangs will gone?

:-)

Re: How a Mexican Drug Cartel Makes Its Billions

#113

Post by vlisivka »

ojbyrne wrote: post #56
kia wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The big difference of drugs from alcohol and tobacco is their addictiveness. While you can't get addicted to alcohol or tobacco after one use, certain drugs cause severe addiction after first dose. Of course you can legalize only mild drugs. But it won't solve the problem because as we see this business is mostly about very addictive ones. EDIT: typo

"Scientists have found, for instance, that nicotine is as addictive as heroin, cocaine or amphetamines..." http://www.nytimes.com/1987/03/29/magazine/nicotine-harder-t...

Food and water are even more addictive than nicotine.

Drugs are changing your brain by altering it rewarding system.

Re: How a Mexican Drug Cartel Makes Its Billions

#114

Post by doktrin »

vibrunazo wrote: post #109
guelo wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, I am saying cocaine should be legalized. People that want the drug today are able to obtain it anyway. We could put all kinds of restrictions on its sale and use, as long as it is easier to obtain legally than underground it would prevent the formation of wealthy criminal gangs.

As shown in the report I linked before. Meth is a highly regulated hard drug that can be obtained legally. [1] Mexican drug cartels still traffic it, still makes tons of profit from it, thousands of people die because of it. Regulating Meth didn't stop the drug war. What exactly makes you think any other drug would be different? [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Methamphetamine

When most people refer to the legalization of "drugs", they are typically implying decriminalized (or semi-decriminalized) recreational use and not tightly regulated medical use (Desoxyn).

This makes sense, since a highly regulated substance is de-facto illegal if it is unobtainable by the vast majority of its target market.

Re: How a Mexican Drug Cartel Makes Its Billions

#115

Post by adventureful »

It's disheartening to see the intense division on this subject on Hacker News. It leads me to believe the issue gridlock will continue, and the only plausible solution (legalization) will continue to be a fantasy. And as a consequence millions will continue to be jailed, tens of thousands will continue to die and the cartels will continue to grow stronger.

Small prediction: the US Government won't legalize drug use and production until the cartels are so powerful the Feds can no longer even partially contain the drug trade. Within a decade the cartels will be powerful enough to directly threaten the US President. I think that'll just about do the trick.

Re: How a Mexican Drug Cartel Makes Its Billions

#116

Post by vlisivka »

btilly wrote: post #73
jlarocco wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm in favor of drug legalization, but it's not going to happen any time soon, and I don't think it would reduce crime even if it did It's hard enough to get pot legalized in most states - the "harder" drugs don't stand a chance. And even if they were legalized, it's not even possible for a big illegal drug operation to "go legit". All of the drug cartels will still have long histories of violence, piles of cash, boa…

The fact that bad people will be bad people does not change the fact that taking away a major revenue source of theirs will lessen how much bad they will do. For a historical analog, look at the Mafia. When Prohibition ended, the Mafia didn't become nice people. They continued a life of crime. However they had diminished power, and we had fewer open gun battles in the streets. On the whole this was a good thing.

Next most profitable thing is prostitution. IMHO, we should let strangers ^k your girl for free to drop street prices.

Re: How a Mexican Drug Cartel Makes Its Billions

#118

Post by adventureful »

jlmendezbonini wrote: post #55
paulhauggis wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At this point, I doubt it will help. Why? The cartels thrive in countries where you can essentially buy off any official. When you legalize drugs, they aren't going to suddenly stop selling it. They will now have a legal business which will continue to fund their criminal empires. We most likely will see an increase in other crimes, like extortion and kidnapping. Drugs are still illegal in the US and we don't really…

>Drugs are still illegal in the US and we don't really see >the same kind of crime in our country because the police >actually (for the most part) do their job. I strongly disagree with your statement. Police? Mexico is not using your usual police officers to fight drug violence neither Colombia. They are using highly trained military forces. Why? Cartels have very advance military equipment that is, sometimes, even…

America has more drug driven crime than anywhere else on earth, by far. The source of the destruction (crime + violence) of our inner cities is purely drug based. Before the drug revolution of the 1960s and 1970s, our inner cities were livable.

A quick examination of the FBI's data on African-American crime proves that out. We put four million black men in prison every decade due to drug related criminal activity, and have nearly two million black men in prison at any given time. The lifestyle of said criminals is always tied to illegal drugs (there's no other profit source powerful enough to drive that kind of crime wave).

Re: How a Mexican Drug Cartel Makes Its Billions

#119

Post by zephjc »

elorant wrote: post #89
silvestrov wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Street price doesn't even need to drop: it is safer for customers to buy it at the local drug store (legal, pure drug) than on the street (unknown quality).

It might be safer but I'm not sure it's preferable. You see the local drug store owner knows you and there's still a stigma for drug consumption. Your local dealer on the other hand doesn't know you and you don't risk been exposed or stigmatized buying from him. If on the contrary you take the huge profits part out of the equation then the whole network collapses; there just aren't enough money to support all the ind…

Re. your first paragraph, here is a counter-example: go to another town where they don't know you, purely to obtain your coke; problem solved.

Besides, haven't you heard the saying: "Always know your dealer"?

Re: How a Mexican Drug Cartel Makes Its Billions

#120

Post by cdibona »

ChuckMcM wrote: post #35
gwern wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

'Money doesn't stink', as the Roman Emperor said. Who's to say they aren't selling? But in any case, money and planes are pretty fungible. Perhaps they use straw buyers, or perhaps they simply buy used. Plenty of 747s out there now.

I was going to say the same thing, you see a lot of them parked on the tarmac in Mojave with out of business livery or sometimes just painted white. There have been stories of folks laundering money in the middle east where there are apparently a lot of 'cash' jobs that take US currency, still the cartoon picture of the pallets of cash was pretty hilarious. I wonder if you could trade a pallet of cash for a check fro…

Tunnel boring machines are extremely difficult to buy and more difficult still to run without oversight. They're just incredibly complex and hard to maintain machines. It's not impossible mind you , I mean, the cartels have all kinds of expertise available to them, but consider that the cartels have access to humans enslaved by their drug habits. Many people, fueled by cocaine, with picks and shovels can make short work of a tunnel like those described in the article.
Post reply on HN