Three month suspension for Python core developer
discuss.python.org
Three month suspension for Python core developer
1–10 of 94 posts
Re: Three month suspension for Python core developer
#2Given the long list of things, as an outsider, it seems like this person was quite disruptive to the community.
It doesn't seem like there's a "this one post was sus", but rather, "we've exhausted other options after repeated violations of our rules across many, many threads."
This seems like basic moderation of a community, and good on the mods for applying their rules even to a core developer?
Re: Three month suspension for Python core developer
#3> Dismissing unacceptable behavior of others as a “neurodivergent” trait, which is problematic because it creates a stereotype that neurodivergent people are hard to interact with and need special treatment.
Why shouldn’t neurodivergent people get special treatment if they have a disorder/issue? Seems like accommodations should be made to promote inclusion.
Re: Three month suspension for Python core developer
#4> Defending “reverse racism” and “reverse sexism”, concepts not backed by empirical evidence, which could be seen as deliberate intimidation or creating an exclusionary environment.
> Overloading the discussion of the bylaws change (47 out of 177 posts in topic at the time the moderators closed the topic)... The later result of the vote showed 81% support for the most controversial of the bylaws changes, which demonstrates the controversy was blown out of proportion.
These two are insane. I'm almost speechless.
The rest don't sound good, and would be enough for a suspension on their own if presented truthfully. So why put those first two? Why put them first?
EDIT: Since no one has linked to it yet, this seems to be the discussion referenced. I haven't gotten to the end of it yet, I admit, but what I read so far looks like one person in particular disagreeing with the prevailing opinion in a fairy respectful way: https://discuss.python.org/t/for-your-consideration-proposed...
Re: Three month suspension for Python core developer
#5This is hard to evaluate without a reference to the discussion the individual is supposed to have negatively impacted.
This may be anything between shutting down someone derailing the discussion by spouting genuine nonsense, to being overreaching and paternalistic, punishing for not conforming to the preordained outcome of a farcical "discussion".
There's enough of either going around nowadays.
Re: Three month suspension for Python core developer
#6> Dismissing unacceptable behavior of others as a “neurodivergent” trait, which is problematic because it creates a stereotype that neurodivergent people are hard to interact with and need special treatment. Why shouldn’t neurodivergent people get special treatment if they have a disorder/issue? Seems like accommodations should be made to promote inclusion.
This isn't what that says. This is saying that when a neurodiverse person breaks decorum (read: is a giant asshole), the correct behavior is to let that person know they are having an impact and give them grace to grow their skills.
Saying, "they are allowed to be assholes because they are neurodiverse" does nothing to help the neurodiverse person, and creates a stigma.
I'm autistic. I constantly tell myself, "being autistic is not an excuse for being an asshhole. I have to work harder to not be an asshole, but I can learn it ".
Re: Three month suspension for Python core developer
#7This is hard to evaluate without a reference to the discussion the individual is supposed to have negatively impacted. This may be anything between shutting down someone derailing the discussion by spouting genuine nonsense, to being overreaching and paternalistic, punishing for not conforming to the preordained outcome of a farcical "discussion". There's enough of either going around nowadays.
Seems like it was many many threads, and the mods looked at them in aggregate. Though they did call out one thread in particular, it doesn't seem like that one thread was the primary motivator here.
This reads like mods, doing modding, which is always a judgement call and never black and white.
Re: Three month suspension for Python core developer
#8My takeaway: The suspended user seems exhausting, and the Python community has skin thinner than Intel's latest node.
Re: Three month suspension for Python core developer
#9Tim Peters, author of timsort and longtime Python contributer, is a graybeard spaz like Stallman:
https://discuss.python.org/t/for-your-consideration-proposed...
I know this type, they definitely know how to belabor a point, and their language can be "colorful". I read through a bunch of comments, and on a scale from 0 to Terry Davis, Tim seems like a 1 or 2, annoying and crotchety but well-meaning and mild-mannered (Linus would be an 8 on this scale). Suspension is a drastic move, and it's hard both to suspend[0] and to be suspended, so I hope the PSF engaged with him offline first.
[0] https://fosstodon.org/@Yhg1s@social.coop/112922140875432669
Re: Three month suspension for Python core developer
#10> Defending “reverse racism” and “reverse sexism”, concepts not backed by empirical evidence, which could be seen as deliberate intimidation or creating an exclusionary environment. > Overloading the discussion of the bylaws change (47 out of 177 posts in topic at the time the moderators closed the topic)... The later result of the vote showed 81% support for the most controversial of the bylaws changes, which demons…
Maybe because they are less obviously bad but they were nonetheless the biggest issues. I've found this before with problematic individuals on forums.
They rarely break "obviously bad" rules because they know they'll get the ban hammer and everyone will agree they they deserved it.
Instead they cause just as much havoc and disruption by doing things that don't seem that bad when they are accused of them.
Eventually they cross the line and get banned anyway, but the moderators have to struggle to explain why and if it leaks into another forum you'll get a ton of people defending the problematic person and saying the mods overreacted. When in reality everyone's probably been struggling to deal with this person's disruptions for months or even years.