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Why doesn't advice work?

dynomight.substack.com

171–180 of 334 posts

Re: Why doesn't advice work?

#171
To me, you have to see the situation clearly, understand the other person em-pathetically AND manage to communicate the resolution of a complex situation that may unfold over a long time. Any of those things would be hard, but all of them together make advice a cursed problem. The author gives an example of his email cycle of marking emails as "Reply ASAP", ignoring them, feeling guilty and purging them. Is the real problem that he does this or that he does this and it makes him feel bad for some reason? Those are two very different problems that presumably require very different "solutions".

Re: Why doesn't advice work?

#173
post #33
post #9

Most people, in my experience, not only do not think logically but actively eschew thinking logically, making long term plans, goal setting, etc. I don't know if it's an intelligence thing. I don't think it is. I have met not so smart people that are incredibly goal oriented and very smart people who piss it all away. I'm at a point in my career/life where I often find myself giving advice to people who aren't intere…

I generally do ignore advice, unless i ask for one, like when i have a problem or when i feel helpless. I just leave people alone and expect the same from them. Everyone is on their own journey, i do not know about theirs and they do not know about mine. Mostly people give under-complex advice, that do not take my situation into account. It always feels out-of-touch. But that is just me.

Advice we learn from we only hear once, advice that doesn't help us you hear over and over so it is easier to remember. So likely you just don't remember all the advice that helped you as you only needed to hear it once.

Re: Why doesn't advice work?

#174
post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Will second that many times. As a fairly proactive guy who almost never leaves any loose ends in his relationships, I overdid giving the advice and some people started avoiding me. I was bitter about it until I realized they did not want their problem fixed, they sought sympathy. Nothing wrong with that, it's just that my mind immediately jumps to potential solutions. But I was severely humbled on that front after I…

> until I realized they did not want their problem fixed, they sought sympathy. That goes both ways, as many of the people I've run into who just want sympathy, can bring a lot of stress on the listeners. E.g. I can't take hearing complaints about abusive partners, etc so that they feel a little better for the moment, then they march right back to them. Growing up with a serious complainer caused me to instinctively…

Quite true. I am not advocating for "always listen" and even if that brands me as a monster I very often do NOT advocate for "always be kind" -- there are many people whose problems I have zero patience for.

My bigger point was that if you consciously chose to sit or take a walk with that person and if you truly care then you should make sure they feel listened to and understood before giving advice -- if you give advice at all.

This presupposes that you care about that person which I'll immediately agree is not a given for most people you'll ever meet.

Re: Why doesn't advice work?

#175

The rules I have for myself when giving advice are: 1. Unsolicited advice is always criticism. 2. LISTEN TO THEIR ACTUAL PROBLEM ALL THE WAY. 3. Never tell someone what they should do, tell them what you would do in that situation. 4. Remember that the purpose of giving advice is just to illuminate options, not to have someone follow what you recommend to the letter. 5. As the advice giver understand that you could b…

The most common problem with advice is that people give it before what they understand the real problem.

If someone tells you their car is broken, it's not helpful to tell them that they should get it fixed, because maybe the REAL problem is they don't have the money for it and are ashamed to tell you. (And maybe the solution to that is more complicated than you think, too.)

For advice to be remotely useful, you have to first put in the time to understand the real problem. It requires a lot of patience and requires you suspend judgment. If you're not willing to do that, then don't give advice!

Re: Why doesn't advice work?

#177
post #109

“Be careful whose advice you buy, but be patient with those who supply it. Advice is a form of nostalgia. Dispensing it is a way of fishing the past from the disposal, wiping it off, painting over the ugly parts and recycling it for more than it's worth.” — Mary Schmich

Ladies and gentlemen of the class of '99 Wear sunscreen If I could offer you only one tip for the future, sunscreen would be it A long-term benefits of sunscreen have been proved by scientists Whereas the rest of my advice has no basis more reliable Than my own meandering experience, I will dispense this advice now Enjoy the power and beauty of your youth, oh, never mind You will not understand the power and beauty of your youth Until they've faded, but trust me, in 20 years, you'll look back At photos of yourself and recall in a way you can't grasp now How much possibility lay before you and how fabulous you really looked You are not as fat as you imagine Don't worry about the future Or worry, but know that worrying Is as effective as trying to solve an algebra equation by chewing Bubble gum The real troubles in your life Are apt to be things that never crossed your worried mind The kind that blindsides you at 4 p.m. on some idle Tuesday Do one thing every day that scares you Saying, don't be reckless with other people's hearts Don't put up with people who are reckless with yours Floss Don't waste your time on jealousy Sometimes you're ahead, sometimes you're behind The race is long and in the end, it's only with yourself Remember compliments you receive, forget the insults If you succeed in doing this, tell me how Keep your old love letters, throw away your old bank statements Stretch Don't feel guilty if you don't know what you want to do with your life The most interesting people I know Didn't know at 22 what they wanted to do with their lives Some of the most interesting 40-year-olds I know still don't Get plenty of calcium Be kind to your knees You'll miss them when they're gone Maybe you'll marry, maybe you won't Maybe you'll have children, maybe you won't Maybe you'll divorce at 40, maybe you'll dance the 'Funky Chicken' On your 75th wedding anniversary Whatever you do, don't congratulate yourself too much Or berate yourself either Your choices are half chance, so are everybody else's Enjoy your body, use it every way you can Don't be afraid of it or what other people think of it It's the greatest instrument you'll ever own Dance, even if you have nowhere to do it but your own living room Read the directions even if you don't follow them Do not read beauty magazines, they will only make you feel ugly Get to know your parents, you never know when they'll be gone for good Be nice to your siblings, they're your best link to your past And the people most likely to stick with you in the future Understand that friends come and go But a precious few, who should hold on Work hard to bridge the gaps in geography and lifestyle For as the older you get The more you need the people you knew when you were young Live in New York City once but leave before it makes you hard Live in northern California once but leave before it makes you soft Travel Accept certain inalienable truths Prices will rise, politicians will philander, you too, will get old And when you do, you'll fantasize that when you were young Prices were reasonable, politicians were noble And children respected their elders Respect your elders Don't expect anyone else to support you Maybe you have a trust fund, maybe you'll have a wealthy spouse But you never know when either one might run out Don't mess too much with your hair Or by the time you're 40 it will look 85 Be careful whose advice you buy but be patient with those who supply it Advice is a form of nostalgia, dispensing it is a way of fishing the past From the disposal, wiping it off, painting over the ugly parts And recycling it for more than it's worth But trust me on the sunscreen

-Baz Luhrmann

Re: Why doesn't advice work?

#179

The rules I have for myself when giving advice are: 1. Unsolicited advice is always criticism. 2. LISTEN TO THEIR ACTUAL PROBLEM ALL THE WAY. 3. Never tell someone what they should do, tell them what you would do in that situation. 4. Remember that the purpose of giving advice is just to illuminate options, not to have someone follow what you recommend to the letter. 5. As the advice giver understand that you could b…

   > 1. Unsolicited advice is always criticism.
This is important to me. Especially when I become a senior, my opinion without much thought can be taken as a criticism and make others irritated or insecure.

Re: Why doesn't advice work?

#180
post #19

> And for producers of advice: Step 0 I think should be "maybe don't give advice". You want to help, you think you're really good, you think it will improve things, but that's not how other people see it. They may seem like they need advice or seem like they are asking for it between the lines, but they just really want to unload or chit chat, or share some difficulty. The answer to that is sometimes to listen and no…

Nine times out of ten, people want to give advice to either 1) to feel cleverer than the person receiving it or 2) get them to stop talking about their problems.

If you're struggling with a problem, do you usually need someone to act smarter than you or tell you to be quiet?

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