Kogan imposes a tax on IE7 shoppers • Hacker News Board

Re: Kogan imposes a tax on IE7 shoppers

#41

Post by mayneack » Thu, Jun 14, 2012, 2:34 AM UTC

_wp3r wrote: post #32

ceol wrote: post #12

I doubt their userbase using IE7 is large enough for this to be a big deal. This tax's real goal is PR for Kogan.

Maybe not for Kogan, but most of the DOD is still on IE6, as an example that is something like 2 million daily users. Uber large business and government is were the users are hiding. The reason the numbers are still off is because those same users are using chrome at there house in the evening. There should be a business only metric for browser usage. That would be very interesting.

Many government offices now have firefox too. Not sure about the ones with higher security concerns, but I know the normal security places have FF.

Re: Kogan imposes a tax on IE7 shoppers

#42

Post by rbanffy » Thu, Jun 14, 2012, 2:35 AM UTC

marshray wrote: post #26

zem wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

not really - during the browser wars, ie had such a large share of the market that if you didn't support it, your site was considered broken, not the browser.

Yes, everybody used that logic back then and it became self-fulfilling. There were a few Mac users back then too. At one time they were influential enough that Microsoft had developed a port of IE to Mac.

They'd rather build a port than risk having Mac users demanding compatibility with their competitor.

Re: Kogan imposes a tax on IE7 shoppers

#43

Post by mayneack » Thu, Jun 14, 2012, 2:37 AM UTC

hammock wrote: post #33

planetguy wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, it's a way to flatter the rest of your customer base, who now get to feel superior for using a different browser. "Hey everybody, I use Chrome, aren't I wonderful?" Further suggestions to let us elite middle-class types feel superior to others: 1. Extra 25% surcharge for anyone who shows up at your cafe wearing Crocs 2. Anyone driving up to your hotel in a Pontiac Aztek has to pay a fifty-dollar uglification fe…

Another (and more realistic) analogy would be a retailer adding a surcharge to your total when paying by credit card.

That's illegal in most states/violates all credit card agreements for the vendor.

(but still a valid comparison)

Re: Kogan imposes a tax on IE7 shoppers

#44

Post by MrVitaliy » Thu, Jun 14, 2012, 2:38 AM UTC

_wp3r wrote: post #32

ceol wrote: post #12

I doubt their userbase using IE7 is large enough for this to be a big deal. This tax's real goal is PR for Kogan.

Maybe not for Kogan, but most of the DOD is still on IE6, as an example that is something like 2 million daily users. Uber large business and government is were the users are hiding. The reason the numbers are still off is because those same users are using chrome at there house in the evening. There should be a business only metric for browser usage. That would be very interesting.

> Maybe not for Kogan, but most of the DOD is still on IE6, as an example that is something like 2 million daily users.

With each passing day, this statement made less and less sense to a point of absurd. And that point has been reached a long time ago.

I work for Department of Interior (the armpit when compared to DOD) and here its either fully patched IE8, latest Firefox or you are booted off of network. Can DOD be really that archaic and still allow employees to browse wild wild web with IE6?

Re: Kogan imposes a tax on IE7 shoppers

#45

Post by eli » Thu, Jun 14, 2012, 2:39 AM UTC

_wp3r wrote: post #32

ceol wrote: post #12

I doubt their userbase using IE7 is large enough for this to be a big deal. This tax's real goal is PR for Kogan.

Maybe not for Kogan, but most of the DOD is still on IE6, as an example that is something like 2 million daily users. Uber large business and government is were the users are hiding. The reason the numbers are still off is because those same users are using chrome at there house in the evening. There should be a business only metric for browser usage. That would be very interesting.

I've seen some numbers that are nearly all business users. They've actually improved considerably in the last year or two. IE6 was quite common in certain sectors like government, finance, healthcare, (see if you can guess what those industries have in common) but in late 2010 and early 2011 people finally really started upgrading either to newer versions of IE or, surprisingly, Firefox.

IE6 use (even among business) is extremely rare right now. Which makes sense, because very few websites would actually work.

Re: Kogan imposes a tax on IE7 shoppers

#46

Post by damian2000 » Thu, Jun 14, 2012, 2:43 AM UTC

mayneack wrote: post #43

hammock wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Another (and more realistic) analogy would be a retailer adding a surcharge to your total when paying by credit card.

That's illegal in most states/violates all credit card agreements for the vendor. (but still a valid comparison)

Not illegal in Australia, where kogan is from. Unfortunately there's no limit on the amount a merchant can charge for payment/card fees. For example, I believe the most popular taxi charge company here (CabCharge) charges a 10% fee when paying by credit card.

Re: Kogan imposes a tax on IE7 shoppers

#47

Post by icambron » Thu, Jun 14, 2012, 2:46 AM UTC

aristus wrote: post #34

kentbrew wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Speaking only on my own behalf and not as part of Lexity, for whom I no longer work, I'd have to say that I'm fine with the risk of losing business from people who are unwilling or unable to update from a seven-year-old browser, "assistive" or not. Sorry to sound short about this, but it's the same sort of thing that happens when a road turns into a freeway. For everyone's safety, you don't get to ride your bicycle.

The OP means "assistive" as in "tools used by people who are disabled". It's not a choice to be blind.

What is the relationship between "assistive technology" and "old browser"? It would surprise me if that tech was only available for IE7.

Re: Kogan imposes a tax on IE7 shoppers

#48

Post by sliverstorm » Thu, Jun 14, 2012, 3:14 AM UTC

MrVitaliy wrote: post #44

_wp3r wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe not for Kogan, but most of the DOD is still on IE6, as an example that is something like 2 million daily users. Uber large business and government is were the users are hiding. The reason the numbers are still off is because those same users are using chrome at there house in the evening. There should be a business only metric for browser usage. That would be very interesting.

> Maybe not for Kogan, but most of the DOD is still on IE6, as an example that is something like 2 million daily users. With each passing day, this statement made less and less sense to a point of absurd. And that point has been reached a long time ago. I work for Department of Interior (the armpit when compared to DOD) and here its either fully patched IE8, latest Firefox or you are booted off of network. Can DOD be…

I am not part of the DoD, but as I understand it a lot of entrenched usage of IE6 these days is usually internal apps. So, perhaps they use IE6 for private networks, and use IE8, Firefox, et al for public-facing workstations.

Re: Kogan imposes a tax on IE7 shoppers

#49

Post by drhowarddrfine » Thu, Jun 14, 2012, 3:15 AM UTC

cdeonier wrote: post #7

I can't help but feel there's a better way to "make the Internet a better place". While it's not ideal customers are using IE7, belittling them and taxing because they might not know better seems a little extreme. The message reads more like developers venting their frustration supporting IE7 rather than trying to make things better.

Considering that we still vent frustration over IE9, it's good to see someone hit some people over the head and get them off this crap browser.

Re: Kogan imposes a tax on IE7 shoppers

#50

Post by paxswill » Thu, Jun 14, 2012, 3:19 AM UTC

MrVitaliy wrote: post #44

_wp3r wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe not for Kogan, but most of the DOD is still on IE6, as an example that is something like 2 million daily users. Uber large business and government is were the users are hiding. The reason the numbers are still off is because those same users are using chrome at there house in the evening. There should be a business only metric for browser usage. That would be very interesting.

> Maybe not for Kogan, but most of the DOD is still on IE6, as an example that is something like 2 million daily users. With each passing day, this statement made less and less sense to a point of absurd. And that point has been reached a long time ago. I work for Department of Interior (the armpit when compared to DOD) and here its either fully patched IE8, latest Firefox or you are booted off of network. Can DOD be…

It's certainly not the entire DoD. Firefox is explicitly supported on most new sites, with specialized plugins available that simplify security setup (install certs, CAC access).